Obama questions... mabey you can help?[OPINION|DISCUSSION]

[H2O Gangsterism]

so i was in utah with my grand parents last week, and i herd that he wouldn't even say the Pledge of Allegiance, and then i saw this (linkage (http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=34009964))... why would we want a president that wont even do an american thing to do... then he doesn't even know that their are 50 states? sure mcain may be old, but at-least he can count.

i may be 16... but these are legit concerns for the nation i will be growing up in.

[TW MikeJG24]

I agree, why would we vote a guy who hates America and wants nothing but its destruction.

VOTE McCAIN 08!!!

[H2O Omega X]

I'm not even american but i think a non patriotic president would be a disaster, in any country, i'd rather see McCain, a vietnam vet in power than Obama

[meow]

Probably refering to this:
http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar/2007/11/obama-says-flag.html

Obama reciting the Pledge of Allegiance:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VIyBwkuqF4E

[H2O Gangsterism]

thanks for the links meow. i feel more informed.

[PMS MelonZ]

i highly doubt anyone is that out of the loop. He either meant he's made 57 visits, or he meant to say 47. I don't vote but if i did i would vote Obama. I like McCain but i don't want another republican in office.

To be honest i don't think there will ever be a candidate that can "save" the nation.

[TW MikeJG24]

i highly doubt anyone is that out of the loop. He either meant he's made 57 visits, or he meant to say 47. I don't vote but if i did i would vote Obama. I like McCain but i don't want another republican in office.

To be honest i don't think there will ever be a candidate that can "save" the nation.

McCain isn't like Bush , he has been quoted saying it in many articles. I think he will be a much better president than Bush if Elected.

[Sapphire]

anyone is better than bush

jmho

[PMS MelonZ]

McCain isn't like Bush , he has been quoted saying it in many articles. I think he will be a much better president than Bush if Elected.

Anyone's better than Bush, and i don't think McCain will be anything like Bush. But i'm politically neutral, i only speculate.

[ToX1C]

Change you can believe in :P But seriously Obamas a younger president new ideas we need some change right now. People complain about taxes going up with obama but whats the alternative? Further cuts on everything more bridges falling down or a higher deficit?

[TW MikeJG24]

NOBAMA is sticker I am going to put as a signature!!

I dont want a president who hates this country like he does even though he won't admit the truth.

McCain will win and this is will be his only term.

[H2O Karmak1ller]

Bush's 3rd Term: McCain 08, NO THANKS!!!!

I was trying to tell people Ron Paul would have been fun!

[PMS Ayane Chan]

Obama alllllll the got damn way for me, bout time we get a lil color in the presidency lol OBAMA 08 skeelas, but thats not my only reason though

[Cortana Siffow PMS]

It bugs me to hear stuff like this. I've lived outside of the US, and I'm so happy to be back in the US. (I missed my freedoms) When I lived in Mexico, one of my friends learned the hard way that you are guilty until proven innocent. And if you think politics here are insane, go south.

I'm always taken aback when people keep dissing their own country. I don't want a president who refuses to say the pledge of allegiance. The simplest act of "protest" can show your true colors.

On a side note. Barack Obama is never gonna give you up, let you down, run around and desert you... (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=65I0HNvTDH4)

[Stasis]

I still don't think obama will win, status quo...

[H2O Commando]

anyone is better than bush

jmho

Charlie Manson is a step up from bush...

[Gun Monkey]

Meh, Obama doesn't know which way is up. He wants to cut gas prices by taxing gas companies. Result? Gas companies raise their prices instead of absorbing the loss. We pay the same, government gets another tax.

When asked how they would lower foreign oil dependency, McCain said "Drill."

Obama said "tell people to inflate their tires properly."

[Kenoke]

I agree, why would we vote a guy who hates America and wants nothing but its destruction.

VOTE McCAIN 08!!!

Note to self: Don't play with Mike ever again when hes drunk..He talks bad.. bad things about obama hahahaha

[TW MikeJG24]

Meh, Obama doesn't know which way is up. He wants to cut gas prices by taxing gas companies. Result? Gas companies raise their prices instead of absorbing the loss. We pay the same, government gets another tax.

When asked how they would lower foreign oil dependency, McCain said "Drill."

Obama said "tell people to inflate their tires properly."


WOW that is the most retarded comment ever, tire pressure has nothing to do with gas lol

[oI Doc Io]

Actually tire pressure does have to do with gas. If a tire in underinflated it requires more energy to roll along which in turn eats up more gasoline. Tires that are 10% underinflated cause a 2% raise in fuel consumption. This doubles for every 10% that your tires are underinflated. So before you go and Bash Obama for what he said make sure you have facts to back them up. Vote Obama 08!!!

[x SexyPink x]

Obama's got this presidency in the bag

[the7ate9]

Two things evidently concern me about Obama, I truely believe America is not ready for a black president, and second his foriegn policy. His position on the Georgia Crisis, ultimately Putin's Russia, and his "diplomatic" effort to resolve issues with Iran/terrorist sponsored countries etc.

[PMS Pip Sq3ak]

VOTE McCAIN!!! NOT OBAMA

[Cortana Siffow PMS]

VOTE McCAIN!!! NOT OBAMA

http://www.nobama.com/images/nobamabumper.jpg

[the7ate9]

this thread is like 85% full of useless ignorance, I mean if you're going to state your position thoughts on the elections, at least do so objectively and imply precise supporting details.

[Wifey]

Actually tire pressure does have to do with gas. If a tire in underinflated it requires more energy to roll along which in turn eats up more gasoline. Tires that are 10% underinflated cause a 2% raise in fuel consumption. This doubles for every 10% that your tires are underinflated. So before you go and Bash Obama for what he said make sure you have facts to back them up. Vote Obama 08!!!

damn homie lol he just opened a can on someone...lol

[the7ate9]

common sense isn't that common

[PMS Pip Sq3ak]

http://www.nobama.com/images/nobamabumper.jpg

YEA YOU GO COR7ANA VOTE McCAIN NOT OBAMA!!!!!

[WoWDimi]

if obama really hated the America then he wouldn't be running.

[Sapphire]

if obama really hated the America then he wouldn't be running.

Why is this so hard for people to realize? You think someone would go through all of this, all of their work etc just b/c they hated America?

I understand if you're supporting another party but don't be immature about it and accuse people of things you know nothing about. It's simple. If you're going to act like children then don't vote.

[JeepChick PMS]

Ok, I am going to run for President. And my platform is

SAVE GAS BY DRAFTING!

Works for Nascar. Mythbusters proved it decreased gas consumption by almost 40% at 5 feet drafting. There's a REAL solution to our gas problem! Who cares if it increases the dangers of driving 100 fold.

/end sarcasm


Drill. Drill it all. I think then we will find that we don't need any foreign oil. Then if we can just get off the Cheap China Crack, we can be much more independant as a nation.

WORD. Vote for JeepChick 2008..... or Bob Barr. There are more than two choices out there guys! Look at the Libertarian Party if you feel like the Dems and Reps don't represent you well.

[CrazyLSU]

Hey I got a email from some friends at LSU well they said no true LSU fan will vote for OBAMA since its a travesty just because he is so for (o)BAMA!!! Just like Jeep said. DRILL DRILL DRILL

[Dynasty X]

well McCain just announced a women from alaska as his vice pres so that will attract alot of voters that wanted hillary to be president, but i know alot of people i have talked to are fed up with republican presidents with what the bushes have done and most are ready for change.

[oI Doc Io]

I agree with Dynasty X, it is time for a change, and I believe that Obama can bring the change that we desperately need in this country.

[Mightybigone]

It could just be me but am I the only one seeing Obama moving towards Socialism ideal?

[PMS KillrQueen]

dear google,
sometimes i wish people would use your vast array of knowledges. Especially when making a choice on who should run this country.
<3, the killer

[Mightybigone]

dear google,
sometimes i wish people would use your vast array of knowledges. Especially when making a choice on who should run this country.
<3, the killer


That a general statement to everyone in the thread or is it meant for someone specific?

[PHiNiX]

Dude peoples need to stop listening to fox news.....it is the biggest piece of trash in the history of television....remember, they wanted bush in office and bashed all the people running against him...and look what happend

unless your net worth is 5 million dollars. do not vote for mccain

mccain=rich white man who would love to see his family make more money....sounds familier

obama=rich black man who would love to see equality and a better financial state of are great nation


and to all the people who say obama hates america............STOP LISTENING/WATCHING FOX NEWS....learn to get information on your own, don't let things be spoon feed to you.



to all the people who think obama is un patriotic give me a reason and I will dispprove you with real facts

[Mightybigone]

Dude peoples need to stop listening to fox news.....it is the biggest piece of trash in the history of television....remember, they wanted bush in office and bashed all the people running against him...and look what happend

unless your net worth is 5 million dollars. do not vote for mccain

mccain=rich white man who would love to see his family make more money....sounds familier

obama=rich black man who would love to see equality and a better financial state of are great nation


and to all the people who say obama hates america............STOP LISTENING/WATCHING FOX NEWS....learn to get information on your own, don't let things be spoon feed to you.



to all the people who think obama is un patriotic give me a reason and I will dispprove you with real facts

You must watch a lot of NBC

[PHiNiX]

actually i dont watch any television news at all... i dont like my information spoon feed to me

im not dumb i can research for myself

[Mightybigone]

You should turn on Foxnews tomorrow cause Bill O'Riley is interviewing Obama.....gonna be interesting

[PHiNiX]

Lol bill is trash...Fox is trash....infact i think all televised news is trash

[Mightybigone]

I'd be interested in what you use to do your "supposed" research.

Wanna link some of your common sites you check out to get your info from?

[PHiNiX]

i dont use any set sites...ill read posts on any politically infulenced site and compare views and policies. of not only one single person but many..but when you watch televised news. they are told what to say influenced by the views of that station and the rich people who run it

[Mightybigone]

what's some of the recent sites you've been to?

[PHiNiX]

i visit alot of sites that are politically neutral, they show equal views from both sides of the table...i dont need to give you links..im sure you can find some on your own

[Cortana Siffow PMS]

It's hard to say what neutral really is. Many say that NPR radio is "neutral" but feels so liberal. (That coming from my independent self)

[KingNothing H2O]

Obama's speech got 38 million viewers. And Sarah Palin's got 37 million. Very interesting.

[PHiNiX]

good thing i dont listen to it....if you have to get your news hand feed to you then you only see what they want you to see.but if you go on the internet were there is free spirit and open mindedness you see alot more


king you also have to remember a few things...people want to see both sides of the table therefore they watch both speeches...and palin is only a running mate...not the runner. so you have to put that into consideration

[Mightybigone]

Normally when people say Fox news is trash, they tend to side with the left

[PHiNiX]

fox news is trash....they are the most bias news station..there is nothing wrong with showing your opinion of somthing...but dont be a dumb ass about it..remember they were the news channel who tried to get mass effect banned because it had nudity...even though they never even played it. and there wasn't even any nudity.......i have lost all respect for fox news

[MacGrandma]

I hate politics/Politicions period lol I think Obama's name is scary though lol Barrack Hussein Obama they even had a thing on it and his father being Muslum is a worry. It's worrysome after 9/11 you know? It was CNN that posted this! lol http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-SX3f2KmOiI&feature=related

[Raevn]

I hate politics/Politicions period lol I think Obama's name is scary though lol Barrack Hussein Obama they even had a thing on it and his father being Muslum is a worry. It's worrysome after 9/11 you know? It was CNN that posted this! lol http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-SX3f2KmOiI&feature=related

His name scares you? That's ridiculous.

Also:
According to Senator Obama, the elder Obama had already abandoned Islam and become an atheist by the time he moved to the United States.[10] Barack Obama Sr.'s daughter Auma has commented that her father "was never a Muslim although he was born into a Muslim family with a Muslim name."[7]

And even if his father was Muslim, that means absolutely nothing.

[H2O Galang]

http://my.barackobama.com/page/content/fightthesmearshome

great list of smears on obama and why they are not true.

[H2O 1MPUR1TY]

ok, ima go throw in my 2 cents and watch what happens...

I've never really liked obama from the start.... not experienced enough (he origionally lied about his experience; instead of his "20 years of experience" he really only has < 8), terrible plan for the nation, etc.

Here's what really bugs me: his whole "plan" only really benefits those who make less than $25,000 a year. If becomes pres, he's gonna pull a robin-hood and raise taxes on the rich. (take from the rich, give to the poor) here's my problem with that; This nation is kept running by the top 4% of our richest people. Now, what happens if we raise their taxes so much, they get REALLY mad and stop working. If they stopped working, the nation would only be getting about 35% of it's normal income. yea, that freaked me out too... regardless, let's go back and recap; Obama's plan is basically encouraging people to not work. From what parallel dimention did this guy come from?!?!!?

~Tony T

BTW I think Palin was a great choice on McCain's part.

[PHiNiX]

only reason why mccain choose her is because everyone is riding the female president train.....and everyone with a brain knows it, she even said she has no clue what the vice president does..but whatever it is she will do it... i sat there and laughed for a bit on that one


http://www.startribune.com/politics/national/27300424.html?elr=KArks7PYDiaK7DUvDE7aL_V_BD77:Dii UiD3aPc:_Yyc:aUU

somthing i was just reading

[PMS saraphanelia]

mccain voted with bush 90% of the time.

[KoRnKiD H2O]

after watching the Katie Couric interview with Sarah Palin I would have to say that Sarah Palin was probably the worst choice for a running mate. McCain's trying to grab as many Hillary supporters as possible, but what he doesn't realize is many of the people who supported Hillary didn't do so because of her gender, it was because of her views and beliefs on important Political Issues. The idea of a Alaskan Soccer Mom as potential President of The United States is scary. Besides.. McCain doesn't support Net Neutrality. And he's said something like.. He'd stay in Iraq for another 100 years if necessary.. Two issues I strongly oppose. I'm a firm believer in Net Neutrality and Bringing Our Troops Home.

Obama/Biden 08!

And say what you want about me being a Canadian. Canadian media is almost nothing but American Politics anymore. Both Biased and Unbiased.

[TwizztiD]

Dude peoples need to stop listening to fox news.....it is the biggest piece of trash in the history of television....remember, they wanted bush in office and bashed all the people running against him...and look what happend

unless your net worth is 5 million dollars. do not vote for mccain

mccain=rich white man who would love to see his family make more money....sounds familier

obama=rich black man who would love to see equality and a better financial state of are great nation


and to all the people who say obama hates america............STOP LISTENING/WATCHING FOX NEWS....learn to get information on your own, don't let things be spoon feed to you.



to all the people who think obama is un patriotic give me a reason and I will dispprove you with real facts

What about his trip to the US military hospital in germany and he wouldnt visit the injured troops if he couldnt bring his camera's in with him?

[KoRnKiD H2O]

What about his trip to the US military hospital in germany and he wouldnt visit the injured troops if he couldnt bring his camera's in with him?

How is that unpatriotic. The real question you should be asking is; Why wasn't he allowed to bring his camera in with him? what is it that they don't want the American people to know/see/hear? And don't give me some b/s like "oh.. we'll those kind of images would be to hard for some people to sit through". There was a ton of coverage on the Vietnam war and it was just as bad as this war. The only unpatriotic thing about what you mentioned is that someone doesn't want the American people to see what is actually going on over the pond. I believe the term is.. "out of sight, out of mind."

[TwizztiD]

How is that unpatriotic. The real question you should be asking is; Why wasn't he allowed to bring his camera in with him? what is it that they don't want the American people to know/see/hear? And don't give me some b/s like "oh.. we'll those kind of images would be to hard for some people to sit through". There was a ton of coverage on the Vietnam war and it was just as bad as this war. The only unpatriotic thing about what you mentioned is that someone doesn't want the American people to see what is actually going on over the pond. I believe the term is.. "out of sight, out of mind."

That is unpatriotic because he only cared about the wounded soldiers when he could take some pictures with them while smiling... AND maybe the soldiers dont want camera's in there hospital? maybe the doctors have a reason to ban camera's from the hospital? regardless of why the camera's are not allowed he still didnt go visit the wounded soldiers because his camera's werent allowed.

[PMS Trina]

so i was in utah with my grand parents last week, and i herd that he wouldn't even say the Pledge of Allegiance, and then i saw this (linkage (http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=34009964))... why would we want a president that wont even do an american thing to do... then he doesn't even know that their are 50 states? sure mcain may be old, but at-least he can count.

i may be 16... but these are legit concerns for the nation i will be growing up in.

McCain couldn't even tell us how many houses he had the first time he was asked. How can you not know how many homes you have? I saw the clip where Qbama was supposedly "refusing to say the pledge of allegiance," and he was actually listening to the national anthem, and even though his hand wasn't on his chest, he was singing along.

[KoRnKiD H2O]

That is unpatriotic because he only cared about the wounded soldiers when he could take some pictures with them while smiling... AND maybe the soldiers dont want camera's in there hospital? maybe the doctors have a reason to ban camera's from the hospital? regardless of why the camera's are not allowed he still didnt go visit the wounded soldiers because his camera's werent allowed.
Show me the evidence to prove this. Where can i find the article stating Obama refused to meet the troops because he couldn't take photo's with them. Obama isn't just some politician looking for a photo-op.

[Mary Jane PMS]

Wow, just WOW! Really people. If you are going to express your opinion, at least TRY to sound like you know what you are talking about! (This is not directed at anyone in particular.) It is late, and I am very tired, but I was just getting ready for bed and read this thread. And just so everyone knows, just because I have my own opinion doesn't mean I don't respect or love you all. My best friend is a Republican, and I love her to pieces (although that doesn't mean I have to agree with her).

FIRST of all... it is not only about McCain/Obama, but the ideology of BOTH parties. And yes, I am registered as a Democrat, but tend to be more in the middle on a lot of things. However, with the situation this country is in, on all fronts, this may just be one of the most important elections of our entire lives.

McCain has NO real plan to help this country. He is a 72 year old puppet, with a soccer mom as a running mate who has had FOUR years in public office. NEVER has made a NATIONAL choice, only been on the city council, served as a Mayor, and been the Governor of A-Freaking-Laska. The state that is "next to Russia." Really... her comment about "What does a VP do exactly", and the fact she couldn't name ONE Supreme Court decision that she didn't agree with other than Roe v. Wade is RIDICULOUS! You really want this woman making choices for our country?!

Please go and do some research, don't just listen to the TV or read the news for your information. Who here is actually registered to vote and plans on going to the polls on November 4th? Schools need to do a better job teaching all of us how to research things for ourselves, and what are credible sources. One should be seasoned on history, globalization, economics, and of course, politics in order to make a choice like this.

Just watch the debates! Obama totally "won" the first one, McCain didn't know what he was saying half the time. As for tonight with the VP picks, Palin didn't even answer the question half the time, she skirted the issue and said things like "I want to talk about blah blah blah." It is a debate, answer the freggin questions woman! You don't get to choose what you talk about, that is why there is a moderator, it is not an open forum to discuss how you are an "expert on energy."

As for Obama not knowing how many states there were... of course he knows! That was a total slip. It was from a interview where he had been talking about how many states he had visited, and had left to visit, or was not going to visit because it was not in the budget. He said he had already visited fifty....seven states... I watched the video, it was an honest slip up. He said he had one state left to go, excluding Alaska and Hawaii because his staff would not justify the visit (which is understandable because of the cost of the trip...) 47 plus 1 left to visit, plus 2 he wasn't going to equals 50. In my opinion that is not a reason not to vote for someone or to think they would make a bad President. After traveling to 47 (soon to have been 48) states, I might slip on my words too.

Now the Pledge of Allegiance thing: Here is a video for you (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VIyBwkuqF4E). And yes, his hand is on his heart. Go to about 1:40 to 1:55 and there ya go.

As for the meeting with the troops: Here is an article for ya (http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/snubbing_wounded_troops.html). It is FALSE that he didn't do it because he wasn't allowed to bring cameras.

"Obama says he never planned to take reporters on the Landstuhl visit, and Department of Defense rules prohibited him from taking reporters on previous visits he made with wounded troops. Reporters were not allowed to accompany him when he visited wounded troops at Walter Reed Medical Center on June 28... Obama visited wounded troops in Baghdad earlier in his overseas trip, but he did so without reporters and without a lot of fanfare, just to say 'Thanks.'"

These are just a few of the "facts" that have been throw around I wanted to dispute. It is funny how sometimes people say things like it is a fact, and then another person believes it, and then passes it on to other people... when really it was false all along. *sigh* Do research, find the correct answers, and then you can make an informed decision. Don't just vote the way your parents tell you, or the way your friends tell you, or the way ANYONE TELLS YOU. It is your vote. Make it count. Make it for the right reasons... The End.

And this is just all my humble opinion, nothing more. :mvboogie:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v640/msmaryjane/obama.jpg

[Mary Jane PMS]

Ohhh! And a lovely lady posted this site (http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/) in the Sarah Palin thread (http://www.pmsclan.com/forum/showthread.php?t=32866) that is in the "Anything Goes" section.

PolitiFact.com! Pretty great stuff all around. (http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/)

[Anex]

Ohhh! And a lovely lady posted this site (http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/) in the Sarah Palin thread (http://www.pmsclan.com/forum/showthread.php?t=32866) that is in the "Anything Goes" section.

PolitiFact.com! Pretty great stuff all around. (http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/)

:D Yay I is a lovely lady!

I was just about to post that link here when I read some of the stuff.. LOL

[Mary Jane PMS]

:D Yay I is a lovely lady!

I was just about to post that link here when I read some of the stuff.. LOL

You are a lovely lady! It is a great link! It shows a lot about all the people concerned! :p

[KaRnAge]

Me leaving for boot camp in the summer I've paid alot more attention and know alot about the candidates. I respect everyone's decision to say what they want about Obama or McCain it's America soldier's died for you to be able to pick who you want as president do so as you please but what I hate the most is when I get up in the morning and go to school to hear people say there voting for obama but when I bring a topic up they go blank. If your voting for Obama just cause he's black I think that's very messed up but if your voting for him because of his political views then go for it. I think as of now that Obama is winning and not because his political views but because of his skin color and I think he's doing what Al Gore did and attract celebrity attention so the people that don't keep up with politics will see hey this celebrity is going to for him why not me. The BIGGEST Issue us as Americans need to focus on is not on the economy but the war in iraq. Pulling out would not be a wise decision as progress has been made significantly in the middle east. If we are to pull out the iraqi people will not respect us as much as they do now, CNN shows Iraqi people revolting when from the many documentantry's I've seen Iraqi people love Americans and love us being over there. Also another key point I would like to make is the experience of both president's and vice president's. Experience is a major up but me talking from a stand point of going for neither one from this conversation I think either of them could pull it off but experience is a major up and consistancy is also a major thing.

[PHiNiX]

well sarah phalin was a bad choice on mccains part, did anyone really watch the debate
she seems to know little of two topics...oil...energy, she even decided to change the questions at times and had answers to a totally differant question, sarah pailin is rich she dosnt know how a normal family works


and why would you vote for mccain if you are not a millionaire? seriously i would like to know

[KaRnAge]

I think Sarah Palin was a good choice on McCain's part but I do think she did lose that debate very badly.

[PHiNiX]

dude she failied misserably.....my middle class family was laughing last nite

[Mary Jane PMS]

"She is as dumb as a box of rocks." I asked my friend what she thought of the debate last night, and that is what she said.

In my opinion, Obama is not winning because of his skin, but because of his political views.

I respect and appreciate everything that the the troops do for our country, however, I do not respect Bush for going to war with Iraq. I know that some people think that is cliche, but it is true... I support the men and women that put their lives on the line in the name of the USA, but I do not support our Commander and Chief who has forced them to do it for what I believe to have been all about oil, not about 9/11. He took advantage of the country when we were at one of the lowest points we have ever been and said that we would find "WMDs" in Iraq, which STILL have not been found. It was a flat out lie, and now it is the war that has cost many American lives, many Iraqi lives, and that has put us 6 TRILLION dollars in debt. That is an expensive war.

Once again, just my opinion.

[VballChick PMS]

have you seen the SNL spoof of her by tina fey, its sooo funny

[Seatownstriker]

I totally agree with people needing to inform themselves on the issues. To base your choices on what you see on tv, hear on the radio, or read in the newspaper is so lazy and apathetic. Just my opinion.

[KoRnKiD H2O]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wK2QjMydQpU

For anyone who takes the 3 minutes out of there day to pay attention.

[Mary Jane PMS]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wK2QjMydQpU

For anyone who takes the 3 minutes out of there day to pay attention.

It's pretty crazy, eh? *sigh* I really wonder what is going to happen in the next year.

[H2O Galang]

Me leaving for boot camp in the summer I've paid alot more attention and know alot about the candidates. I respect everyone's decision to say what they want about Obama or McCain it's America soldier's died for you to be able to pick who you want as president do so as you please but what I hate the most is when I get up in the morning and go to school to hear people say there voting for obama but when I bring a topic up they go blank. If your voting for Obama just cause he's black I think that's very messed up but if your voting for him because of his political views then go for it. I think as of now that Obama is winning and not because his political views but because of his skin color and I think he's doing what Al Gore did and attract celebrity attention so the people that don't keep up with politics will see hey this celebrity is going to for him why not me. The BIGGEST Issue us as Americans need to focus on is not on the economy but the war in iraq. Pulling out would not be a wise decision as progress has been made significantly in the middle east. If we are to pull out the iraqi people will not respect us as much as they do now, CNN shows Iraqi people revolting when from the many documentantry's I've seen Iraqi people love Americans and love us being over there. Also another key point I would like to make is the experience of both president's and vice president's. Experience is a major up but me talking from a stand point of going for neither one from this conversation I think either of them could pull it off but experience is a major up and consistancy is also a major thing.

sorry dude but your totally wrong, the biggest issue is not iraq.....its the economy. your totally freakin brainwashed by the propaganda, they dont want us over there and we need to get out now!

[VballChick PMS]

my niece is 2 she can say barack obama! lol i know our family members are voting for obama, including me cause hey im old enough now lol. but my decision is on what i am and what im for so im going for obama, cause i want gay rights but i dont want to turn this thread into a gay rights post so im gunna stop at that lol...

[oI Doc Io]

sorry dude but your totally wrong, the biggest issue is not iraq.....its the economy. your totally freakin brainwashed by the propaganda, they dont want us over there and we need to get out now!

First of I would like to say that I do not agree totally with what H2O KARNAGE is saying but it is his right to have an opinion and to voice it, and it is people like H2O KARNAGE and myself which are brainwashed by propaganda that give you the freedom to make your ridiculous remarks on how military personnel are brainwashed and that we need to pull out of Iraq. Us pulling out of Iraq right now would do nothing for our economy other that make it worse than it already is. We need to finish what we have started in Iraq so that the troops that gave their life for their country will not be in vein.

[H2O Mexican]

I Agree With Mr. Sponge My Sister Is Going Back To Iraq In Jan >.< So I Would Like To See Her Come Back Soon!

P.S I Love Soccer Moms.

[v Midnight v]

For those of you looking for good factual links, here is one of my favs...cause i love money (it pays for my xbox and my games)!

The website I thought was very helpful is www.taxpolicycenter.org this is "a nonpartisan research group whose staff of experts includes former economic advisers to the White House and Congress under both Republicans and Democrats." It consists of two Institutes and their findings are based on facts and analyzing data. I posted this in another thread, but it had some more details!

Below is a list of different groups with a visual chart comparison. If the Individual Income Tax is in ( ) means you would get that as a credit if it has just 85,946 that means you would have to pay that much in taxes…example in one plan if you were single and elderly and made 1.5 million you would have to pay 85,946, in the same plan if you made 74,000 you would receive a tax credit of 3,690, noted as (3,690).

Find your tax bracket and enjoy getting educated on facts!

Nonelderly unmarried: http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/numbers/displayatab.cfm?DocID=1975

Nonelderly married: http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/numbers/displayatab.cfm?DocID=1840

Elderly: http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/numbers/displayatab.cfm?DocID=1977

Whoever said the rich would stop working OMG that so made me laugh!! Hunny the rich don't work and they spend their vaca and spending cash across the pond!

PHiNiX and Mary Jane I <3 you both!!

[RiNoH]

Wow, just wow. I really really really hope that 90% of what I read in this thread was from people too young to vote.
I just read some of the most ignorant and under-educated statements ever. For one thing, get off of Obama for making a speech error. I don't "not like" McCain simply becuase he mixed up Iran and Iraq publicly (which comes off a little scarier than saying the wrong number of states). Why don't you look at each candidates political stand on topics of importance. Instead of obsessing over some mis-construed story about the pledge that was probably blown out of proportion from the start.
Go educate yourself before you post a thread that makes you look silly. I don't understand why so many people are mis-informed about so many things, when it's so easy to go out and get the RIGHT information.

[H2O Gangsterism]

Hey Rinoh... Who are you, and where are you from?
I didnt post this thread for dumb people like you to come in, and give your two cents about how you feel. Why dont you just ignor it, and not post if you dont like it? Think before you post somthing like this again.

[Raevn]

hey rinoh... Who are you, and where are you from?
I didnt post this thread for dumb people like you to come in, and give your two cents about how you feel. Why dont you just ignor it, and not post if you dont like it? Think before you post somthing like this again.

Internet police. Hands in the air.

[Esty H2O]

Hey Rinoh... Who are you, and where are you from?
I didnt post this thread for dumb people like you to come in, and give your two cents about how you feel. Why dont you just ignor it, and not post if you dont like it? Think before you post somthing like this again.



This is a public forum in the anything goes section mind you. He is free to give his two cents, whether or not anyone agrees with it. Name calling will not be tolerated. Please everyone behave yourselves.

[Esty H2O]

Wow, just wow. I really really really hope that 90% of what I read in this thread was from people too young to vote.
I just read some of the most ignorant and under-educated statements ever. For one thing, get off of Obama for making a speech error. I don't "not like" McCain simply becuase he mixed up Iran and Iraq publicly (which comes off a little scarier than saying the wrong number of states). Why don't you look at each candidates political stand on topics of importance. Instead of obsessing over some mis-construed story about the pledge that was probably blown out of proportion from the start.
Go educate yourself before you post a thread that makes you look silly. I don't understand why so many people are mis-informed about so many things, when it's so easy to go out and get the RIGHT information.


Every person is free to state thier opinions, please as I said to Gangsterism, name calling and belittling will not be tolerated.

[H2O Hamlet]

I agree with Esty. Let's be respectful of each person's opinion.

Politics is always a nasty subject- so I'll try to not get personal. When you look at it, politics is basically one big argument, with sub-arguments thrown in the mix.

I will be voting McCain Palin in 2008. I can sit here for arguments on why the Government should be put to the side, why taxes should be lower, why we need to remove 22% of the government programs put into effect by Democratic Presidents in the past- which do nothing but take in that Tax Money. 22% of programs, in a recent audit, proved ineffective and pointless (AKA DEFICIT SPENDING). I believe in finishing a war against terrorists that, only 7 years ago, killed thousands of americans on American Soil. Why would you want to leave when victory is in our grasp? Also, I don't hear the word "Victory" coming from the Democratic side. Why empower the government EVEN MORE by giving them control of Health Care? Americans don't like the government, it's too powerful. Why give it more power?

I'm done here. I lightly tapped into my reasons, and thankfully I kept it clean and political. Bashing politicians isn't something I'm too fond of. I doubt any of you could run this country, and our current administration has done the best possible with the circumstances and information given to them. It's easy to blame the head of the country when something goes wrong, but they don't look into the facts.

I'd be happy to discuss political issues in private with anyone that wishes to have a better understanding of the right wing.

Hamlet
California College Republicans
McCain Supporter/Volunteer (GOP Presidential Candidate)
April Boling Supporter/Volunteer (7th District San Diego City County)

One of my Favorite Quotes by President Ronald Reagan:
The Nine Most Terrifying Words in the English Language are, "I'm from the Government and I'm here to help."

[H2O Mexican]

I'm A Beast.

[CrazyLSU]

Ok I believe i read somewhere in here about economic equality. If you actually think thats possible you might want to take off those rose colored glasses. That will never happen, can never happen, and should never happen. There will always be a job that either somebody wont do period, wont do for the pay, or there is someone that will do it for less. Its simple economics. As for more government. Thats the last thing we need. We fought to be free of a king who told us what to do. Now people are wanting government to basically tell them what to do. That goes against one of the main reasons this nation was formed in the first place. National Health care is just an extenuation of the welfare programs. I personally dont believe in giving handouts out. O and for the person that might have thrown that back in my face regarding the current status of our economy. I dont agree with that either. The reason that we are in this situation with the economy is because people were given credit that they did not qualify for. You had people getting loans for houses that they damn well knew they could not afford. I am not just talking about the housing market either. I am talking about credit in general. If all of the debts in this country were called up for collection at this moment I bet that over half the country would be SOL. If it wasnt for the companies paying payroll on credit i would say leave the credit markets frozen. We as a country need to go back to being a country that saves instead of spending every penny we make.

[H2O Gangsterism]

so i was in utah with my grand parents last week, and i herd that he wouldn't even say the Pledge of Allegiance, and then i saw this (linkage)... why would we want a president that wont even do an american thing to do... then he doesn't even know that their are 50 states? sure mcain may be old, but at-least he can count.

so in this first statement that i made, it says i herd. Like I herd from a source, and it doesnt mean its hard evidence. second, the video i linked, u can clearly see he says 57 states. so its not i have the information wrong, its the democratic runner cant count.

here is the video again.
http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=34009964

[CrazyLSU]

Ok i got a question. Both of the campains are pushing their tax cuts. Why not just put in place a 16-17% flat tax. Everybody pays the same.

[EE TW1STED]

We should vote on things! Because that is what we are supposed to do! yay!

[CrazyLSU]

We should vote on things! Because that is what we are supposed to do! yay!

I thought that was why we sent people to washington, so we could vote on things. Not so they could put in so much red tape that nothing ever gets done. Why do we need a tax code that could fill up a small car? Piling pork projects into almost each and every law they pass. Hell even with this "bail out" bill they pushed those pet projects in.

[Jane PMS]

LOL ok, McCain is an idiot and Palin is a complete freak of nature. If you actually pay attention and research what they are about you will see who is doing what. Most of you are taking something you got in a spam mail or heard from someone and blowing it out of proportion. Half informed people = why we have an idiot as a president right now. open your eyes and look at what these guys are doing. Im not in the money bracket for McCains plans and My guess is neither are 99% of you. Why would you vote for Taxing medical benefits??! Half informed like I said. Anyways, If my vote actually counted anyways I probably would vote for Obama. But since it goes off electoral votes in the first place, im keeping my happy ass at home. We all saw what happened when it went to the voters in florida when Gore won. Yeah... bush ftl. We are in a financial crisis because of idiots in this country. Then he wins the second go round against kerry cuz ppl wanted to "see how he fix's his mistakes" IDIOTS! Im moving to canada!

and BTW, Our financial crisis is not from the credit we gave out to ppl that didnt desirve it.. It was from the trillions of dollars we have spent on this dumb ass Iraq war. Go ask blackwater ho wmuch money they make a day.. paid for by our government I might ad. All the money they have spend on this super highway... Puhh leasseee.. Yeah.. blame the housing market..

[Jane PMS]

Wow, just wow. I really really really hope that 90% of what I read in this thread was from people too young to vote.
I just read some of the most ignorant and under-educated statements ever. For one thing, get off of Obama for making a speech error. I don't "not like" McCain simply becuase he mixed up Iran and Iraq publicly (which comes off a little scarier than saying the wrong number of states). Why don't you look at each candidates political stand on topics of importance. Instead of obsessing over some mis-construed story about the pledge that was probably blown out of proportion from the start.
Go educate yourself before you post a thread that makes you look silly. I don't understand why so many people are mis-informed about so many things, when it's so easy to go out and get the RIGHT information.

Very well said! /clap

[CrazyLSU]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wK2QjMydQpU

For anyone who takes the 3 minutes out of there day to pay attention.

He hit the nail on the head with that one. Credit has become too easy to get and that is one reason we are in the position we are in now. We need to get back to the policy in which the only way you could get credit was if you had the collateral to back up the debt.

[Jane PMS]

He hit the nail on the head with that one. Credit has become too easy to get and that is one reason we are in the position we are in now. We need to get back to the policy in which the only way you could get credit was if you had the collateral to back up the debt.

So how do you propose people buy a home? save up 400k and just buy it yourself?

[CrazyLSU]

So how do you propose people buy a home? save up 400k and just buy it yourself?

400k are you crazy? If you are going to buy a house that damn expensive you shouldnt even worry about credit. That is one thing that got us in the situation we are in now. People bought more then they could afford. For the people that bought houses with floater loans, they should have known that the price of the loan could have gone through the roof. You have people blaming the banks for making the loans in the first place and for not telling them that the loan could go up. All i have to say is read your mortgage before you sign it! These 0% down loans gotta stop. The home buyer needs to pay down 20% or more. Pretty much if you cant do that you cant afford the house.

[H2O VENOMous1]

LOL ok, McCain is an idiot and Palin is a complete freak of nature. If you actually pay attention and research what they are about you will see who is doing what. Most of you are taking something you got in a spam mail or heard from someone and blowing it out of proportion. Half informed people = why we have an idiot as a president right now. open your eyes and look at what these guys are doing. Im not in the money bracket for McCains plans and My guess is neither are 99% of you. Why would you vote for Taxing medical benefits??! Half informed like I said. Anyways, If my vote actually counted anyways I probably would vote for Obama. But since it goes off electoral votes in the first place, im keeping my happy ass at home. We all saw what happened when it went to the voters in florida when Gore won. Yeah... bush ftl. We are in a financial crisis because of idiots in this country. Then he wins the second go round against kerry cuz ppl wanted to "see how he fix's his mistakes" IDIOTS! Im moving to canada!

and BTW, Our financial crisis is not from the credit we gave out to ppl that didnt desirve it.. It was from the trillions of dollars we have spent on this dumb ass Iraq war. Go ask blackwater ho wmuch money they make a day.. paid for by our government I might ad. All the money they have spend on this super highway... Puhh leasseee.. Yeah.. blame the housing market..

If YOu YES YOU decide to stay home and not vote then YOU HAVE NO RIGHT TO COMPLAIN AFTER THE ELECTION. So go out and vote. It may be the only right we have left.

[CrazyLSU]

and BTW, Our financial crisis is not from the credit we gave out to ppl that didnt desirve it.. It was from the trillions of dollars we have spent on this dumb ass Iraq war. Go ask blackwater ho wmuch money they make a day.. paid for by our government I might ad. All the money they have spend on this super highway... Puhh leasseee.. Yeah.. blame the housing market..

OK then why are people defaulting on loans in record numbers even before the market went into the shitter?

[Jane PMS]

That is whats so fun about being an American. I can choose to vote or not and I still have the right to complain after the fact. WOOT!

ok so 400k might have been a bit much. My parents live in a 400k home. My husband and I recently moved to WA and even with our credit score of over 700, plus a VA Loan we were still denied a home loan. So my wondering is.. who the hell is getting these loans and messing them up. Obviously people that have a lot of money to "flip" homes, or go into a variable rate, not understanding that the price would rise. Making their home go into forclosure and then the government buying them back. So my family, trying to get a 200k home ( because that would make our monthly mortgage around 1200). Still cannot buy a home and we are currently living in an apartment with our 4 kids. I dont have any credit cards, I have one vehicle and I still find this funny that people blame the credit and home issue on our recession. Do any of you know how much money it takes to send troops over seas. Let alone bring them home. Why do you think they extended the deployment times. So hopefully we could have enough money budgeted to bring them home when the time came. If your solely taking the word of Bush and his theory on the excess of homes being built to the number of people buying. Then people need to open their eyes. YES, it was an issue when people buy homes they cant afford. YES its an issue when people have to go through debt consolidation because their mommy and daddy didnt teach them how to manage their money. But even more so that that is How much money our government spends on things that we shouldnt even be involved with in the first place. Our medical sucks, but hey lets vote for McCain and start taxing the little benefits we do have.

Go back to your 8th grade history teacher and find out how the voting process actually works.

For presidential elections (held every four years in the U.S.), the candidate that gets the most votes within a particular state gets all of the 'electoral votes' for that states.
Then, all of the electoral votes are added up. The candidate for the presidency, that gets the most electoral votes becomes the next president (assuming they don't die before January 21st of the next year, when they will be inaugurated.)

Back to the housing thing. I totally agree with having 20% down for homes. If i had it I would go get one right now. Thankfully I have the option to use a VA loan where 100% of the costs are covered, a perk for my husband being in the military and going over seas numerous times for the sole purpose of making sure oil fields arnt caught on fire. Even though we pay out the ass for gas still.

All I am saying is, Please make sure you fully investigate each candidate before you make a choice for voting. If your not voting for someone because of idiotic reasons then shame on you. I am also saying that the housing/credit issue is not the only reason our country is failing financially.

Here is an the cost of the war in Iraq up to the second. Maybe that will make you think twice on why our country is UBRFAILING!

http://www.nationalpriorities.org/costofwar_home (http://www.nationalpriorities.org/costofwar_home)

Just a side note... Let me get this straight. A Republican administration enters office with a $300 million surplus. Eight years later we have a trillion dollar deficit. Why should we be worried about a Democrat taking office?

[CrazyLSU]

Jane i just to clear something up. You are only saying that the IRAQ war was a mistake not Afghanistan. right? I agree with you that if that is the case. I agree that the war is a huge weight on the market. As for the market when it comes to the current financial situation. The housing market has had a major effect on the ability of our market to function correctly. When banks made these loans they only insured them for pennys on the dollar and were not expecting to have this number of loans default. So when the debts were called up, the banks couldnt pay. Now with these banks falling on their faces left and right, other banks are worried that if they loan out money to other banks that bank might not be there in the morning to collect on the loan. They dont know who has these credit default swaps on their balance sheets thanks to companies transparency being non existent. I understand how you feel with being turned down for loans. My parents and I recently went and tried to purchase two new vehicles and were turned down even though we were putting about 50k down between trade-ins and cash. Between my parents and I we both couldnt qualify for the loan even though it was only about 30k. Personally we havent had a good choice for President in the past 12 years and Clinton was a half ass choice his second term. I agree with you. Know what you are talking about before you make the choice of who you are going to vote for.

[Jane PMS]

Yeah, I think we were correct in going into Afghanistan. Thats where the threat was. Although people rushed into Iraq like a 15 year old boy on his prom date. There are a lot of things that are messed up with this country but in retrospect all we have to blame is ourselves as a whole for not taking responsibility. I think it was Russel Crowe that said. Why not give every american family 1 million dollars. We would be spending less than the proposed shitty bill and everyone would be able to pay off their debt or buy out their home. Therefor fixing the problem. I haven't actually done the math on it. But it sounded like a good idea. Id like to pay off my 30K Minivan and buy a house outright. At least then I would know the bank couldn't take it back in 5 years when we are in a depression and reliving the grapes of wrath.

[CrazyLSU]

Yeah, I think we were correct in going into Afghanistan. Thats where the threat was. Although people rushed into Iraq like a 15 year old boy on his prom date. There are a lot of things that are messed up with this country but in retrospect all we have to blame is ourselves as a whole for not taking responsibility. I think it was Russel Crowe that said. Why not give every american family 1 million dollars. We would be spending less than the proposed shitty bill and everyone would be able to pay off their debt or buy out their home. Therefor fixing the problem. I haven't actually done the math on it. But it sounded like a good idea. Id like to pay off my 30K Minivan and buy a house outright. At least then I would know the bank couldn't take it back in 5 years when we are in a depression and reliving the grapes of wrath.

Give every american family a million dollars? You do understand that the price of commodities would go through the roof if that did happen. Wow i thought the population would riot at 140$ a barrel oil. If that happened I would almost guarantee that you would see well over 250$ a barrel. You can just figure that if every american family got a million dollars then all prices would go up. you could just look at it as supply, demand, and the ability to pay. With a million dollars you damn well will be able to play and dont tell me that the market wont realize that.

[Jane PMS]

lol. taking into consideration retailers are stupid and wont jack the prices... Then it would be a good idea haha

[CrazyLSU]

lol. taking into consideration retailers are stupid and wont jack the prices... Then it would be a good idea haha

lol. yeah i dont see that happening. Just compare the 50's and today. You used to have nickle candy bars back then. Now you are lucky if you can get it for under a dollar. The price of everything went up. People began making more money and thus producers and retailers were able to sell the same good for a much higher price because the percentage of the wealth spent back then and today is nearly the same thanks to inflation. O they will jack prices, you can bet your bottom dollar on that.

[WarPriest]

On a side note. Barack Obama is never gonna give you up, let you down, run around and desert you... (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=65I0HNvTDH4)

ARGH! I got 'Bama Rolled. GOBAMA 08!

[KoRnKiD H2O]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DBAsHTSbkXs

McCain calling the JFK Assassination an "Intervention".. then mumbles and changes to Tragedy.. and notice whenever he makes a "Freudian slip" he wipes his nose.. lol

[KoRnKiD H2O]

RAWR... double post again -____-;

[Seatownstriker]

Yeah you realize by Obama going after big businesses, Jobs are going to go flying out the door? Those companies will move elsewhere because of the higher taxes. We are going to end up a socialist country. Be careful why you vote. And where you get your information. Getting it from the media is irresponsible. Its bias to one party or another. Just my opinion. I'd rather not vote for either of them.

[Athena Twin PMS]

Fact is, this is a time of war and terrorist...and there is no way Obama should be 10 feet of the whitehouse at all in my oppinion. The presidency is for our COMANDER IN CHIEF you guys, and Obama has NO EXPERIANCE at all! He was only a Sentor for less then six months, I can't believe he would even be a consideration to put behind our armed forces! I would trust Hilary 10 times more in the white house, and I can't stand her at all! However, she at least has the experiance to know we would remain safe...even if I disagee with her ultra socialist policies.

Maybe in a more peacful time and more experiance under his belt, Obama could become a great canidate...but for now, McCain is the only way to go on this one.

[KoRnKiD H2O]

is universal healthcare really that socialist? lol I'm canadian, we have universal healthcare.. and we sure as heck aren't socialist..

[Famous]

I'm going to write in master chief on my ballot neither are qualified for office. Obama is the lesser of the two evil. Although I love seeing Palin giving speeches. Guess that makes me a maverick. ;)

[Athena Twin PMS]

Here is an the cost of the war in Iraq up to the second. Maybe that will make you think twice on why our country is UBRFAILING!

http://www.nationalpriorities.org/costofwar_home (http://www.nationalpriorities.org/costofwar_home)

Just a side note... Let me get this straight. A Republican administration enters office with a $300 million surplus. Eight years later we have a trillion dollar deficit. Why should we be worried about a Democrat taking office?

Yeah, war is what brought the deficit up for sure...but we have been at war this whole time so to just look at numbers is not the best way to go since it has also helped the economy as a whole by suppling hundreds of thousands soldiers, personel, and cilivians with jobs and benifits as well…and also gives a chance for people with limited education to get training, experiance and schooling and do something for their country.

Should we had tucked our heads in and let thousands of helpless people be slaughtered for religion and land rights? Should we have said "Wow, I guess we deserved that" when terrorist attacked us in 9/11 in retalitation? Perhaps we should have let Sadam become our leader so we would not have to worry about anything other then death and dying?

Just think, if we hadn't gone to war we could have spent all the money we would have saved on unlimited welfare for everyone and illegal immigrants to have healthcare AND education! Woo hoo! :mvshakefist:

[H2O Bloody]

fact is, this is a time of war and terrorist...and there is no way obama should be 10 feet of the whitehouse at all in my oppinion. The presidency is for our comander in chief you guys, and obama has no experiance at all! He was only a sentor for less then six months, i can't believe he would even be a consideration to put behind our armed forces! I would trust hilary 10 times more in the white house, and i can't stand her at all! However, she at least has the experiance to know we would remain safe...even if i disagee with her ultra socialist policies.

Maybe in a more peacful time and more experiance under his belt, obama could become a great canidate...but for now, mccain is the only way to go on this one.



thank you very much!!

[Jane PMS]

Yeah, war is what brought the deficit up for sure...but we have been at war this whole time so to just look at numbers is not the best way to go since it has also helped the economy as a whole by suppling hundreds of thousands soldiers, personel, and cilivians with jobs and benifits as well…and also gives a chance for people with limited education to get training, experiance and schooling and do something for their country.

Should we had tucked our heads in and let thousands of helpless people be slaughtered for religion and land rights? Should we have said "Wow, I guess we deserved that" when terrorist attacked us in 9/11 in retalitation? Perhaps we should have let Sadam become our leader so we would not have to worry about anything other then death and dying?

Just think, if we hadn't gone to war we could have spent all the money we would have saved on unlimited welfare for everyone and illegal immigrants to have healthcare AND education! Woo hoo! :mvshakefist:

Im not saying that we were wrong in going into Afghanistan. I really believe that if Osama took credit for the 9/11 incident, then we should have concentrated our efforts there instead of invading Iraq over supposed weapons of mass destruction that Have not been found to this day. Error? Apparently.

So many soldiers have lost their lives for what reason? To protect our country? I wasn't aware of a problem with Iraq at the time 9/11 happened. I do know that Obama doesn't have experience with the "war on terror" but you really have to weigh all of their platform. Not just the fact he doesnt have experience in that one area. He would be the command in chief yes, But that doesn't mean it dumbs down the rest of our military, the generals, commanders, sergeant majors, platoon sgts's, squad leaders and privates.

I cant seem to get over this whole abortion issue and the taxing our medical benefits. Im already broke being a military wife. We don't get paid hardly anything, Our medical benefits is the only reason we stay in the military. We cant afford it in the real world. A lot of military people join because its so hard to be able to take care of your family with a regular 9 to 5. I try to do what I can with my extra things I do during the day. But I cant even go get a 9 to 5 er because I wouldn't be able to afford day care. I would love to get a job and am well qualified for many gaming jobs out there in Washington state. But it would cost me 1800 a month just on day care out here.. Plus I have to buy school clothes, school supplies and everything else they need. Thank God I qualified for free lunches. Anyways, Im just saying that I would rather have someone who isnt that experienced with the military, because we have a lot of qualified people that are his advisors and in charge of the military itself, than someone who wants to get rid of the morning after pill/ prevent women from getting an abortion if they choose to do so, tax our medical benefits, take birth controll off of our coverage and close down family planning clinics which does so much to educate our youth.

Everyone weighs the issues differently and I wouldnt want to impose my own views on someone else. This is america and its our right to vote for who we choose. I just get frustrated when I see people say," I wont vote for obama because his middle name is Hussein". People that can make really good informed decisions and vote for what fits their ideals and values is a great thing. Just don't go vote if your only voting for someone because they have a nice middle name or because of the color of their skin.

19 days till voting. Everyong get out and vote! <3

[Xzodus]

Change you can believe in :P But seriously Obamas a younger president new ideas we need some change right now.

Agreed, to be honest; a LOT of problems are still in a pickle because of money grubby conservationists, we need progressive thinkers in positions of power to make a difference.

Personally after 9/11, I didn't recite the pledge nor sing it, it is a REALLY long story, but it has to do with my families ethnicity (even though I choose not to follow their religion); it is a choice, and it does not make you 'unamerican', because I support America, so I guess that rules me out of being 'unamerican'.

[CrazyLSU]

19 days till voting. Everyong get out and vote! <3

this from the person that said she wasnt voting because of the electoral process.

[Jane PMS]

this from the person that said she wasnt voting because of the electoral process.

That was sarcasim....o.O

[Seatownstriker]

Obama's ideas aren't really new. Hes talking about taking money you make, and spreading it around and you won't be able to do anything about it. Giving it to people who have no inclination of getting up and getting a job. This reeks of Socialism. I personally don't want some bum getting money just cause he has a pulse.

[CrazyLSU]

That was sarcasim....o.O

i know it was a shock. i am very very very very rarely sarcastic :p

[v Midnight v]

Obama's ideas aren't really new. Hes talking about taking money you make, and spreading it around and you won't be able to do anything about it. Giving it to people who have no inclination of getting up and getting a job. This reeks of Socialism. I personally don't want some bum getting money just cause he has a pulse.

I'm curious, where did you read this? I didn't see that anywhere in any of his tax plans or domestic policy plans. Thanks!

By the way I would just like to point out that in 2000 McCain ran against Bush as the Republican choice for President. Republicans wanted Bush rather than McCain...so after (im sure) reading the facts between both, Republicans thought Bush would be a better President than McCain. Although I know McCain lost some votes on rumors that he had a black child out of wedlock, which was false but he lost those votes in the SOUTH (I know we are all shocked here). I just wanted to point out the fact that the republican party voted for BUSH as presidential candidate and NOT McCain and yet now they are saying McCain would be better? interesting...

I actually really like McCain and have cheered him on for years, but this year he tried to pull the Bush way of running and it makes me sad for him. I just don't feel I can trust him to do the right thing anymore. Plus I can't stand his choice for a running mate she has no business in the white house...except maybe as a dinner guest.

The war is very important...war anywhere is, but if we don't have the financial backing then it doesn't matter where we are at war and for how long. Our economy isn't just for our national security or our general welfare, our economy as we have seen has an effect on the world.

[Wifey]

Yeah, war is what brought the deficit up for sure...but we have been at war this whole time so to just look at numbers is not the best way to go since it has also helped the economy as a whole by suppling hundreds of thousands soldiers, personel, and cilivians with jobs and benifits as well…and also gives a chance for people with limited education to get training, experiance and schooling and do something for their country.

Should we had tucked our heads in and let thousands of helpless people be slaughtered for religion and land rights? Should we have said "Wow, I guess we deserved that" when terrorist attacked us in 9/11 in retalitation? Perhaps we should have let Sadam become our leader so we would not have to worry about anything other then death and dying?

Just think, if we hadn't gone to war we could have spent all the money we would have saved on unlimited welfare for everyone and illegal immigrants to have healthcare AND education! Woo hoo! :mvshakefist:

no we shouldnt have tucked our heads in when 9/11 happened but we should have went after the person who organized it. which is Osama Bin Laden and we are pretty sure he's Afghanistan correct? well then why are we in Iraq? the war in Iraq really has NOTHING to do with 9/11. and we found Saddam so y are we STILL In iraq?!?!?! i dont get it....if someone has a logical answer to this please tell me! i would love to hear it so i wouldn't feel like my brother is in iraq for NOTHING!

and i can think of MUCH better things they could be spending money on in our country besides this "war" in iraq...how about better health care for AMERICANS or more affordable educations for AMERICANS!

[CrazyLSU]

no we shouldnt have tucked our heads in when 9/11 happened but we should have went after the person who organized it. which is Osama Bin Laden and we are pretty sure he's Afghanistan correct? well then why are we in Iraq? the war in Iraq really has NOTHING to do with 9/11. and we found Saddam so y are we STILL In iraq?!?!?! i dont get it....if someone has a logical answer to this please tell me! i would love to hear it so i wouldn't feel like my brother is in iraq for NOTHING!

and i can think of MUCH better things they could be spending money on in our country besides this "war" in iraq...how about better health care for AMERICANS or more affordable educations for AMERICANS!

Cause now that we are there if we leave before the government is stable enough to take care of itself and defend its own people it will end up turning into another Somalia and Rowanda. I agree we shouldnt have gone in in the first place but now that we are there we cant leave till it is safe to.

[Wifey]

Cause now that we are there if we leave before the government is stable enough to take care of itself and defend its own people it will end up turning into another Somalia and Rowanda. I agree we shouldnt have gone in in the first place but now that we are there we cant leave till it is safe to.

yea i guess ur right...but i dont think we need to send more troops and thats what McCain wants to do right? Most of them don't even want us there. They would suicide bomb us at the first chance they got! and im not saying everyone in iraq is like that but y do we have to have our soldiers there for something that really has nothing to do with us?

y are we so worried about other countries all the time? when we have ppl in our own country who need homes and food. we are always so quick to save another country....why can't we save the ppl in our own country first?


i know i know, im asking questions nobody can answer...

[CrazyLSU]

but y do we have to have our soldiers there for something that really has nothing to do with us?

y are we so worried about other countries all the time?

Ill give it a shot. Its because the rest of the world believes that we should police the world. The rest of the world hates us for getting involved in things when they dont believe we should be there but when they are on the ropes and are begging for help who is normally the first ones to come save their asses. One major reason we are in Iraq right now is because of OIL. We need it they got it and we will fight for it. That is one reason we are still there. If we leave and the radicals take control of the country then we can kiss that oil supply goodbye. I can almost guarantee that this will not be the last war fought over oil. If Iran shuts off the Straight of Hormuz like they were threatening to a few months ago. I will bet we will go to war because of that.

[Wifey]

Ill give it a shot. Its because the rest of the world believes that we should police the world. The rest of the world hates us for getting involved in things when they dont believe we should be there but when they are on the ropes and are begging for help who is normally the first ones to come save their asses. One major reason we are in Iraq right now is because of OIL. We need it they got it and we will fight for it. That is one reason we are still there. If we leave and the radicals take control of the country then we can kiss that oil supply goodbye. I can almost guarantee that this will not be the last war fought over oil. If Iran shuts off the Straight of Hormuz like they were threatening to a few months ago. I will bet we will go to war because of that.

oy vey! :mvshakefist:

[H2O Creation]

Ill give it a shot. Its because the rest of the world believes that we should police the world. The rest of the world hates us for getting involved in things when they dont believe we should be there but when they are on the ropes and are begging for help who is normally the first ones to come save their asses. One major reason we are in Iraq right now is because of OIL. We need it they got it and we will fight for it. That is one reason we are still there. If we leave and the radicals take control of the country then we can kiss that oil supply goodbye. I can almost guarantee that this will not be the last war fought over oil. If Iran shuts off the Straight of Hormuz like they were threatening to a few months ago. I will bet we will go to war because of that.


fair enough on the oil thing, isnt that the reason why your supporting georgia against the russians... but the rest of it mate. i think your a little bit up your own ass...

well the rest of the world probably feels that america screwed up so yes they should be in there sorting it out...

begging for help hmmm not sure where your going with that one???

"We need it they got it and we will fight for it."

wow just wow.... your like a spoilt brat.. i think we should send you to boot camp..

[CrazyLSU]

wow just wow.... your like a spoilt brat.. i think we should send you to boot camp..

Actually dude i did try and enlist when i was 18. I cant pass the physical. I am totally deaf in one ear and 30% in the other. Other then that I would be in the armed forces right now. Spoiled brat eh... if i could, i would be over there.

ok as for the "We need it they got it and we will fight for it." comment... yeah i could have worded it differently but the theory behind it is sound as a rock.

[H2O Creation]

"We need it they got it and we will fight for it."

sounds like you about to steal something to me... i wouldn't say that was sound as a rock...

[CrazyLSU]

I see your point thats why i said that it should have been worded differently. All i meant was that the US will protect its interests. And well energy is one. Thats why we need to get energy independent. If we would actually put our money where our mouth is then we could be independent in less then 10 years. That would help keep us out of these kinds of wars.

[H2O Creation]

how about rephrasing this one too

"The rest of the world hates us for getting involved in things when they dont believe we should be there but when they are on the ropes and are begging for help who is normally the first ones to come save their asses"

Now all these invations have been fuelled with alternative motives ie preserving energies and so on cant quite think where the begging comes from when the majority of your excursions on done on your own accord...???

[CrazyLSU]

Well i think i will just retract that statement cause i cant think of any other way to put it. I am an isolationist. I don't believe that we should be in any other country unless attacked. NATO and the UN yeah those are a joke. They are corrupt as hell. I personally believe that we should let the rest of the world fend for itself and stick to our borders. What little of one we have thanks to the mass problem of illegal immigration.

[Mary Jane PMS]

Ill give it a shot. Its because the rest of the world believes that we should police the world. The rest of the world hates us for getting involved in things when they dont believe we should be there but when they are on the ropes and are begging for help who is normally the first ones to come save their asses. One major reason we are in Iraq right now is because of OIL. We need it they got it and we will fight for it. That is one reason we are still there. If we leave and the radicals take control of the country then we can kiss that oil supply goodbye. I can almost guarantee that this will not be the last war fought over oil. If Iran shuts off the Straight of Hormuz like they were threatening to a few months ago. I will bet we will go to war because of that.

No, what we need is to have invested that money in finding OTHER forms of fuel. Which there are... but the people are so set in there own ways that no one understands that by using oil we are killing our planet, and in 7 years, if we don't cut emissions substantially we are going to heat up this planet to where we can't go back.

And the world doesn't like us being the police. But when any country needs help, of course someone is supposed to help. Do you not know who put Saddam in power? We did. Do you know about the genocide in the Sudan? Or the fact that Burma has been terrorized for decades? And do we help? No. Why? Because there is no oil, no money for us.

Well guess what? We aren't getting anything free from Iraq. We are paying to be there, we are paying for oil, and most importantly we are paying with the lives of Americans and innocent Iraqis.

[Mary Jane PMS]

And just to clarify. Iraq is not part of the United States of America. We had no right to go there. We have no right to stay there. We had no right. They LIED to us about WMDs... they just hoped they would find some so they could have had a reason. But guess what, they didn't. And do you remember, oh about 5 years ago when the President said "Mission Accomplished"... HA!

We should have been searching for Bin Laden. He is behind who attacked us, not Saddam. And oh yes we are promoting "freedom"... HA! hahaha. The only thing we are promoting is anger, hate and war.

[H2O Creation]

well the UN are peace keepers there not countries after power, leadership or capitalisation... but they bring aid to countries who are threatened whether its war, natural disasters or disease. they fight poverty in africa and other third world countries. so as their a joke do you think they should give up their cause...

Well NATO i'm not quite sure but are they more in the line of security, well in this day in age i think even if they are corrupt not to mention like most other governments within the world... im sure they do have their uses...

i think it was shakespeare that said that no man is an island... you should never burn bridges my friend in what ever business your in.... i think thats enough for tonight as we are venturing off topic...

[Mary Jane PMS]

Well i think i will just retract that statement cause i cant think of any other way to put it. I am an isolationist. I don't believe that we should be in any other country unless attacked. NATO and the UN yeah those are a joke. They are corrupt as hell. I personally believe that we should let the rest of the world fend for itself and stick to our borders. What little of one we have thanks to the mass problem of illegal immigration.

I hate to think of what would have happened during WWII if everyone thought this way. Fact of the matter is. We SHUT OUR DOORS to Jews fleeing from Hitler's war path. We turned the ships away. It breaks my heart.

And we should not stay in Iraq and spend the money we are when America needs help. They have PLENTY of money, and they can figure out their own country. We did our part and took Saddam out of power, which wasn't even our place anyway.

[H2O Creation]

that was thew whole point because America and Britain did go in and take out sadam we left their country open to all sorts, so leaving the country to defend for its self after we ripped it apart looking for one man would be appalling...

[CrazyLSU]

No, what we need is to have invested that money in finding OTHER forms of fuel. Which there are... but the people are so set in there own ways that no one understands that by using oil we are killing our planet, and in 7 years, if we don't cut emissions substantially we are going to heat up this planet to where we can't go back.

And the world doesn't like us being the police. But when any country needs help, of course someone is supposed to help.

OK my family is basically big oil. My dad works for a oil supply company and my mom owns some wells. Thats all i am going to say about that. Just wanted state where i am coming from. I agree that we need to find new forms of fuel. I am just saying that for the SHORT term that oil is going to have to be a part of the SHORT term solution. There is no way that we can swap the entire country off of oil until there is the infrastructure for the new source to be distributed. I am all for ethanol, biodiesel, thermal, wind, solar, hydrothermal, nuclear, anything that will cut emissions. Iceland is using geothermal to basically power the entire country Brazil is energy independent thanks to ethanol. It can be done and we need to do it.

As for policing the world. I say let the world fend for itself. We have enough problems here at home to take care of without having to take on the rest of the worlds problems too.

I hate to think of what would have happened during WWII if everyone thought this way. Fact of the matter is. We SHUT OUR DOORS to Jews fleeing from Hitler's war path. We turned the ships away. It breaks my heart.



I fully agree with us taking part in WWII. We were attacked by the Japanese. And as i said earlier i am for isolationism unless we are attacked. As far as i know the only other war i would agree with is the one in Afghanistan. I don't agree with what we have going on in Iraq or the reasons in which we are there.

I am sorry if i offended anybody in what i said. I normally dont get involved in these kind of political threads or debates period. I know i dont have the popular or majority view of things in the world. And that is all i am going to say on this topic and as far as politics too.

[Mary Jane PMS]

Opps... double post. The last one is the one I edited.

[Mary Jane PMS]

You didn't offend me. I don't think that you offended anyone, at least I hope people don't get offended, they can state their opinions as well.

I respect everyone's opinions and beliefs... but that doesn't mean that I have to agree. It is good to have spirited debates so that all views and opinions can be discussed, new facts and ideas can be offered, and even someone may see things from a new light.

I just think that if we got involved in WWII a few years sooner, we could have saved hundreds, thousands, maybe even hundreds of thousands. For me, waiting until we got bombed was too long a wait. And dropping a nuke was the worst thing any country has done to another country.

[CrazyLSU]

I just think that if we got involved in WWII a few years sooner, we could have saved hundreds, thousands, maybe even hundreds of thousands. For me, waiting until we got bombed was too long a wait. And dropping a nuke was the worst thing any country has done to another country.

If we had not dropped the nukes then the losses for both sides would have been far more then those lives that were lost in both of the bomb drops.

[Mary Jane PMS]

If we had not dropped the nukes then the losses for both sides would have been far more then those lives that were lost in both of the bomb drops.

If we had helped stop the war when we had the first word of the horrors happening overseas then maybe we wouldn't have had the losses we did.

But it is true, the war could have gone on much longer. We talked about both points in one of my history courses.

[H2O.pry0r]

I'm not stating my opinion about my politcal choice, nor am I really staying on subject much either, but in regards to a post about Obama not willing to see wounded soldiers unless cameras were allowed in there is a good reason why they weren't allowed. So to the person who rambled on about the U.S. hiding what really goes on over there and whatnot, look up PATIENT CONFIDENTIALITY. You know, the law that forces medical staff to not disclose any information on a patient?

And to Mary Jane, I agree that using a nuclear device is a horrible thing to do, but in the end it saved lives. The bombs we dropped are what caused Japan to surrender. Maybe you don't know how the Japanese are, they're fierce fighters and would rather die than surrender. That's where the nuclear bombs came in to play. Nobody is dumb enough to fight a country with that kind of power.

[CrazyLSU]

If we had helped stop the war when we had the first word of the horrors happening overseas then maybe we wouldn't have had the losses we did.

But it is true, the war could have gone on much longer. We talked about both points in one of my history courses.

As for stopping the war earlier... the american people back then pre pearl harbor did not want to go to war. They did not want to take part in another european war. If we had of invaded the home islands of Japan the estimates i just found said that loses for both sides would have totaled over 1 million. The total lives lost in the 2 nuke drops on Japan total just north of 200 thousand.

[H2O Creation]

yes it could of gone on longer so i suppose we must be thankful to the russians for collapsing the german strong hold in berlin...

[Rice Time]

i think obama isnt experienced enough.
but i hate sarah palin so much, that the thought that theres a chance she could be president terrifies me and makes me believe that maybe mccain shouldnt be elected, because shes so awful, and een less experienced then obama, and i knwo that there are a fair amount of lesbian/bi members, idk if you know, she wants to converts gays back to straight, she thinks that they need to be.
and dont tell me im a kid, because i know alot about what palins done, so at 14 im not as stupid as you think :)

[Mary Jane PMS]

Nobody is dumb enough to fight a country with that kind of power.


Except Al Qaeda?

[CrazyLSU]

Yeah but they know we wont use it. Its not a country we are fighting its a ideology.

[H2O Creation]

Except Al Qaeda?

where did that come from am i having a blonde moment?

[H2O Creation]

ohhhh im going to slleeep my eyes are shutting...lol

[H2O.pry0r]

Except Al Qaeda?

Good point....

"Nobody EXCEPT Al Qaeda" Now it's fixed :mvclap:

[H2O Creation]

well if you cant hit back at them there not that dumb are they...its pretty hard to retaliate on a group with no fixed abode... your cant nuc every one.. haha

[H2O.pry0r]

I forget what page this was on, but it was something about the U.S. not being begged for help. Anyone seen Blackhawk Down? Somalia needed help, we helped. 7th Special Forces is constantly doing humanitarian missions in South America. Tons of Army medical units go to foreign countries to set up portable clinics and treat people for free. So yes, we do help.

[CrazyLSU]

I forget what page this was on, but it was something about the U.S. not being begged for help. Anyone seen Blackhawk Down? Somalia needed help, we helped. 7th Special Forces is constantly doing humanitarian missions in South America. Tons of Army medical units go to foreign countries to set up portable clinics and treat people for free. So yes, we do help.

yeah that was just me talking out of my ass

[H2O Creation]

haha thats funny

[H2O.pry0r]

well if you cant hit back at them there not that dumb are they...its pretty hard to retaliate on a group with no fixed abode... your cant nuc every one.. haha

Actually we could. With the nuclear missiles we have, we could nuke the world, but doing that would just be stupid now wouldn't it? It wouldn't take many nuclear bombs to destroy the world. Even if you didn't bomb every part of the world, the cloud of debris would cause us to go in to another ice age.

[H2O Creation]

please dont ever run for president,,, lol

[H2O.pry0r]

yeah that was just me talking out of my ass

Eh. You were right though. When another country is crying for help, the U.S. is generally the first one there. And for that matter, we're usually the first one there even when a country isn't crying. My example of the 7thSF group shows that perfectly. South America didn't whine about needing help, we saw it ourselves and volunteered to help.

[Mary Jane PMS]

*sigh* Off the other topics, the moral of the story.... McCain is dumb. He picked Palin as a running mate. There ya go.

[H2O Creation]

whos winning the elections over there anyway?

[KaRnAge]

November, also I would like to say that everyone has the right to express there opinon about the president the war and this country so before I go on I wanted to state that. Also there is a war story that gets graphic but it's to show a point so I warned you if your sensitive to this to skip the story, Thank you!

Now with the war in Iraq I think we should stay in there because not one soldier I've talked to and I've talked to over thirty has said we should move out because they've seen what goes on over there. I talked to a friend of mine when I was playing Airsoft that was telling me some stories of the **** he saw, here's one to broaden your view and show you why we should stay. One day him and his squad left base to go out into a market to distribute food and other supplies to the Iraqi people everything went fine and well until on the way back they saw a woman with two men and one Iraqi militant, the woman had hit one of the men walking across the street because the man grabbed her crotch. The two men turned around and started beating this woman to the point were she was bleeding very bad. An Iraqi police officer had arrived shortly after and helped the woman up, my friend being the guy that he was got up in a very hostile area went to the women and helped her as much as he could after that the two guys still were very violent getting mildly aggressive with the officer but the officer never fired a shot or hit them back because my friend told me the officer later told him that the two guys that beat that woman were known around the area to have raped and killed multiple kids and women. The point of this story is to show you that the Iraqi people need help getting rid of Al Qaeda, the troops over there now are training these officers to not be afraid and to stand up for there country if we were to move out all that would be to waste and more women and children would die and terrorist attacks will happen even more because Al Qaeda will think there victorious. Another thing when you say Bush forced the soldiers into Iraq, he didn't force them when I talked to my recruiter about infantry he told me that I will go through training come back for 10 days and then be shipped off somewere and that theres an 85% chance that I will go to the middle east I still told him I wanted to join beacuse I support the war because remember vividly my dad waking me up and telling me that a plane had hit the World Trade Center and seeing people with missing limbs and trying to find there family members only to find rimnents left. When someone does something like that to innocent people that's a type of hate that nobody can describe, now I wake up in the morning to hearing people talk down about the war because it was about oil it was about this, it wasn't about Oil if it was about oil we wouldn't have left a couple days after september 11th.

Watch this video and see what happend on the 11th and tell me if you don't think we should be over fighting.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LxJiiWo0JbE

[MacGrandma]

Fact is, this is a time of war and terrorist...and there is no way Obama should be 10 feet of the whitehouse at all in my oppinion. The presidency is for our COMANDER IN CHIEF you guys, and Obama has NO EXPERIANCE at all! He was only a Sentor for less then six months, I can't believe he would even be a consideration to put behind our armed forces! I would trust Hilary 10 times more in the white house, and I can't stand her at all! However, she at least has the experiance to know we would remain safe...even if I disagee with her ultra socialist policies.

Maybe in a more peacful time and more experiance under his belt, Obama could become a great canidate...but for now, McCain is the only way to go on this one.

Ditto!!!!!!!! I pledge allegiance to the flag, our country, and the safety of our troops who have had for a long time before Bush had all their supplies deleted and quashed for issue, we had a riot in Los Angeles and our own National Guard had no bullets and had to go in with guns and not one bullet! Secret yeah don't tell anyone I talk to all our soldiers, reasons??... money was too tight under Clinton. I was a military wife during Clinton and saw everything locked down, no pay raises for cost of living, supplies for our soldiers denied, lower pay, delete and let go of anyone who has spent their lifetime in the military that is close to retirement so he can't get retirement pay. Close all the bases on the coasts and sell them properties for trillions of dollars so our coasts will be open to attack. California coastal property you don't think next to Presideo of Monterey, Presideo of San Francisco, El Toro, Tustin Air Field and other small army air force establishments on the coast sold for much?? lol I am not going to go anywhere else but what I saw happen in my lifetime in that living environment the thousands of officers, and enlisted being dropped out of service so they couldn't get a retirement check some months away!!! There are tons of other issues that Bush has had to work with. You know you can make a company dump in the stock market by throwing out scares but real life and living through all the hardship you cannot take away from memory!! Want to PM me against this!! I lived it. I won't ever forget what Clinton did to our military and country because of these changes.

[PMS Jean Grey]

Okay well, everyone else is putting in their 2 cents so I would like to join in on the fun. First of all I disagree with both parties on so many issues I am completely frustrated that both candidates are weak.
Obama wants to socialize the country...look at Canada's medical system and you will see why this is definitely something that we would all regret doing...send me a msg and I will explain if you have no idea what I'm talking about. Obama also talks about tax cuts but then he talks about all the extra spending that he wants to do.
Now McCain is all for corporate America and giving them tax cuts. He also wants to try to make insurance carriers cover anyone with a pre-existing condition...because that won't make the cost of insurance even higher. He has no idea what the middle class is about. Neither does Obama or Biden for that matter. The only person who actually has any clue what it is like to be in the middle class is Palin...and she's the only person in the race that isn't a product of our current not so wonderful system. If she were running for president I would vote for her because she would be a breath of fresh air.
And, the last count of who owns over 50% of our treasury....guess who....CHINA. So if they called in their debt we would be very SOL.
If you want to blame someone for what the economy is doing right now you should blame all the dishonest people out there. People who got into houses that they couldn't afford and then, since they didn't invest any type of downpayment on the house they just walk away and expect the bank to deal with it. The mortgage lenders who lent to people who couldn't afford the houses. People on wall street that increased the value of their own stock options by the illusion of buying until the price went up then they dumped their worthless shares on someone who was just a little bit dumber than them at which point the stock price plummets and dumber loses money. Everyone in our country who is living beyond their means and NOT working to pay back their debt. Yes the government did have a little hand in this...lowering the interest rates to start this idea of if you can't afford it right now just take out a loan for it. Also, if you want to blame the government and George Bush look at who controls the House...it's not the Republicans, it's the Democrats. The president can't just pass bills as he pleases, he has to have support. So continue to blame Bush all you Democrats but it's definitely not his fault. Look to your own party for the blame. People in this country need to quit blaming the government for everything and expecting the government to take care of them...everyone needs to start taking care of themselves and not be such consumers of everything. At least that's my opinion...

[Wifey]

i hate politics...it gives me a stomach ache!!! :(

[CrazyLSU]

People in this country need to quit blaming the government for everything and expecting the government to take care of them...everyone needs to start taking care of themselves and not be such consumers of everything. At least that's my opinion...

Perfectly said. The American people need to take charge and fix the country. Not count on the government to give handouts and try and fix everything. If the government gets involved then things will only go down hill even faster. As for politicians they only work for the highest campaign contributor. They havent been on the peoples side for YEARS!!

[Wifey]

Perfectly said. The American people need to take charge and fix the country. Not count on the government to give handouts and try and fix everything. If the government gets involved then things will only go down hill even faster. As for politicians they only work for the highest campaign contributor. They havent been on the peoples side for YEARS!!

and how do u expect us to just take charge? lol

[CrazyLSU]

you act like this is a dictatorship with the dictator in the white house and capital building. Well i guess it is a dictatorship. But the dictator is in all the towns and cities in the US!!! We need to hold our representatives responsible for what they do. Every 2 years half the congress is up for election. If you dont like what your representative did in those 4 years. VOTE THAT SOB OUT!!! We dont need to be sending the same corrupt people back to Washington year in and year out.

[Wifey]

yea easier said then done crazy...

[MacGrandma]

i hate politics...it gives me a stomach ache!!! :(
Me too lol I hate politics! :) Give me a game anyday I can talk about that forever. politics are to me boring convo but that's just me. It doesn't interest me. :/

[H2O Hamlet]

Crazy is absolutely correct.

Americans have forgotten what it means to be American. They have fell with the corruption and need to remember the roots of this Country. Nowadays people believe that the Government has all the power, and is "oh so nice" to give us rights and power. NO! This is completely wrong. We as Americans, we the people, give power to the government. It is our rights to begin with, to which we allow the government to govern us through our own will.

Our Founding Fathers fought the American Revolution against an Oppressive Government, they didn't want more government- they wanted their freedom's and a limited government. The Constitution was written to protect us from the government itself. It doesn't empower Government, but gives it it's limits. But our Government has twisted it around in their favor- and Americans are buying into it.

This is a Democracy, and we as Individuals have our Freedoms and Rights. It's time for Government to be put on the side, time to end Deficit Spending from Government Programs that are ineffective, time to REFORM this bloated government and create a government of the people and for the people.

Constrain the federal government to its legitimate constitutional functions.
Spend only what is necessary, and tax ONLY to raise revenue for ESSENTIAL government functions.
Traditional Family Values.

Funny... the 3 principles I listed above come from the GOP Platform and Website.

[H2O Creation]

Crazy is absolutely correct.

Americans have forgotten what it means to be American. They have fell with the corruption and need to remember the roots of this Country. Nowadays people believe that the Government has all the power, and is "oh so nice" to give us rights and power. NO! This is completely wrong. We as Americans, we the people, give power to the government. It is our rights to begin with, to which we allow the government to govern us through our own will.

Our Founding Fathers fought the American Revolution against an Oppressive Government, they didn't want more government- they wanted their freedom's and a limited government. The Constitution was written to protect us from the government itself. It doesn't empower Government, but gives it it's limits. But our Government has twisted it around in their favor- and Americans are buying into it.

This is a Democracy, and we as Individuals have our Freedoms and Rights. It's time for Government to be put on the side, time to end Deficit Spending from Government Programs that are ineffective, time to REFORM this bloated government and create a government of the people and for the people.

Constrain the federal government to its legitimate constitutional functions.
Spend only what is necessary, and tax ONLY to raise revenue for ESSENTIAL government functions.
Traditional Family Values.

Funny... the 3 principles I listed above come from the GOP Platform and Website.

yeah that is funny... i was reading through what you wrote and i thought to myself that you sounded like a politician and was about to say its easily said than done...

[CrazyLSU]

yeah that is funny... i was reading through what you wrote and i thought to myself that you sounded like a politician and was about to say its easily said than done...

dude everything is easier said then done. but if its not worth doing then it is not worth saying and vice versa

[H2O Creation]

your quite ingenius with your words. you should speak to the politicians... as they love to say things and not follow through. you might even make a half decent one with your ways of the world.

[CrazyLSU]

your quite ingenius with your words. you should speak to the politicians... as they love to say things and not follow through. you might even make a half decent one with your ways of the world.

Dude i hate politicians. I wouldnt even vote for me :p

[H2O Hamlet]

I think I'm done here. I'll gladly talk about politics with any of you. But what I stated stands.

I'm an American, and when needed a Politician. And if you aren't a politician, if you don't get involved, then you are part of the problem, and not part of the solution. Thank God for America, for the Freedom's we have, our Liberty, our Independence, our Rights, and when needed to provide safety and the good of the world, our Power. Because this is the land of the FREE, and home of the BRAVE. And no government should take that freedom from me, and with the right people in office they won't.

McCain Palin in 2008.
Vote for a REAL Change, don't "Hope" for one.

Sorry administrators, I tried to stay away from this topic, but since I strongly believe in my country and the good of our national security and economy, I had to post more than once. This is my last post, and I encourage all to speak to me in private if they'd like.

[KoRnKiD H2O]

Take the following picture into consideration
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y191/Andy25a/1224555682916-1.jpg

[Wifey]

Take the following picture into consideration
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y191/Andy25a/1224555682916-1.jpg

off topic but i see your now H2O...congrats :)

[Mary Jane PMS]

Take the following picture into consideration
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y191/Andy25a/1224555682916-1.jpg

Well said. :mvboogie:

And just to put this out there, just because "the left" or those "radical liberals" want to use the system that America has to help the people, doesn't mean that our Founding Father's wouldn't have wanted to do the same thing. There have been a lot of changes since our country was formed: the Industrial Revolution, two world wars, and massive population explosion, etc.

If conservatives had there way, there would be no Medicaid (which is the only reason I can have this child and not pay upwards of $20,000), and no funding for GOOD public schools. Sure, your tax dollars are helping me, they are helping everyone, including you. Roads, libraries, schools, public transportation, medical care for people that need it, you name it. If those insurance companies didn't have outlandish costs, and ridiculous rules (I couldn't get my pregnancy covered with insurance because it was considered a "pre-existing condition") then I wouldn't have needed to apply for Medicaid.

And if we didn't tax, we couldn't invest the money into things that help this country to be what it is. And less you forget that the wealthy people in this country have been getting tax cuts for the last 8 years. There is a happy medium, don't get me wrong, but now is not the time for some 72 year old man to step in who doesn't even have the common sense to pick a running mate that could be President if something happened to him. She was on the city council 4 years ago for goodness sake. Never made a choice for the country as a whole, nor seen how things are in Washington, D.C.

Obama '08. REAL change. He is going to do amazing things for this country, just you watch.

:mvclap:

But that is only my opinion, everyone is different, has different ideas, and different priorities. My morals and views have always led me to do things to help those in need, not judge them or look down on them. And if the government can actually step in and help this country, why not let it? The constitution is there for a reason, and our freedoms and liberties are intact. Oh wait, that's right. They aren't because of the Patriot Act, hmmmm.... wonder who did that? Maybe it was those darn "tax and spend liberals" -- not.

[Mightybigone]

They aren't because of the Patriot Act, hmmmm.... wonder who did that? Maybe it was those darn "tax and spend liberals" -- not.


Um, correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't this senate vote show Obama voting to renew the patriot act?

http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=109&session=2&vote=00029

[Mary Jane PMS]

Um, correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't this senate vote show Obama voting to renew the patriot act?

http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=109&session=2&vote=00029

It does indeed. It also shows 88 people who also voted yes, against a whooping 10 that voted no. So just because I don't agree with it doesn't mean that Obama didn't vote just like EVERY republican in the Senate. I will add that only democrats and one independent voted no, which I agree with...

But I guess I should have worded my last post differently. Thanks for the correction. But no conservative voted to give Americans back their rights. There could be a great anti-terrorist bill passed that didn't hamper on our own individual freedoms.

I think Obama is the best choice we are given. I didn't say I will always agree with him on EVERY thing.

[v Midnight v]

Take the following picture into consideration
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y191/Andy25a/1224555682916-1.jpg


that rocks!

[H2O Creation]

that rocks!

naaa its probably totally biased...

[KoRnKiD H2O]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l40nrw3V3GA

Sarah Palin actually believes that the VP is in-charge of the US Senate.... wow
The Majority Leader is in charge of the Senate. The VP sits in the chamber only to break tie votes. -_-

[PMS Aloma]

Okay... so I saw this thread about a million times, and because I'm Canadian and cannot vote, I didn't want to even start reading it because any countries politics get me riled up. HOWEVER today, after 2 hours of sleep I couldn't resist, so I began to read (from page 1). I ended on page 4. I'll be honest, 95% of what I've read so far is... well... I don't want to offend anyone, so fill in the blank lol

Here are a few of my [beautiful, socialist-grown] thoughts...
1. The world has so many negative thoughts about the US right now, that I'm a) Happy to see someone ACTUALLY knows something like tire pressure affecting gas consumption and b) hoping your new president, whomever he be, make the thoughts about your country more positive. Every US citizen I see/hear is very patriotic... but do you even know what you're standing up for anymore?
2. I hate it when US citizens refer to yourselves as AMERICANS. You are the United States OF AMERICA. You are not America. America consists of you, as well as your bordering countries, no matter how much you wish we weren't there. lol That being said, I'm going to sat something that totally contradicts what i just said lol - When you call yourselves Americans, it's kind of right, because whatever your country does, affects the whole world. Honestly, I feel like I should be able to vote in your election because your president affects my life more and more everyday, which, to be honest is so messed up it can only be described in words which would be filtered lol
3. R-E-S-E-A-R-C-H!!!!! All of your lives are affected by this election, research who will be running your lives, your country, and essentially, this world. That mean seem exaggerated, but if the next presidency is anything like the last, he won't just be a Nation's Leader, he'll pretty much be a World Leader. You all, as US citizens owe the world a better choice! Put your own biases aside, stop listening to the super-biased media and ACTUALLY see what the candidates have said. Make your vote dependent upon educated and thorough research as opposed to copying your favorite celebrity, doing what you think is 'in' or listening to what the news says.

Don't hate me ;) I love y'all like you're my actual brothers & sisters.
just couldn't stop my fingers from typing once I saw a particular post lol
I'm sorry if I offeneded anyone... it's okay, you can blame it on my socialist values & morals if it makes you feel better, I promise I won't get mad, Us Canadians are sweet like that lol :P

[v Midnight v]

naaa its probably totally biased...

lol totally! (but sadly still based on facts)

[H2O Creation]

lol totally! (but sadly still based on facts)

yeah your probably right but cartoons always discredit politics...

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=s5KAt30yQDM&eurl=http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=spitting+image&sourceid=navclient-ff&ie=UTF-8&rlz=1B3GGGL_enGB280GB280

[Jane PMS]

Obviously everyone has a difference of opinion. I do think there are issues with both candidates and I am not jumping up and down on my couch rooting for 1 person to win. weighing the pros and cons, I am voting for Obama. There is so many things I'd like to say but I can't get into it now. I still see a lot of people making comments on things that are not true. I still see comments being made about the war in Iraq that are untrue as well.

They do not want us there, they want us to leave, they do not want us there, they do not want us there. How many times do we have to let people know that church and state dont mix. Its the same with Iraq. We got Saddam out of power, Give the country back to its people. It will NEVER be safe there because you have your suni and shiites that have been at war since around Jesus days! Its not going to change because"Americans" went in and/or are staying. Anyone who believes that is retarded. I have been there, my husband has been there, my brother has been there, the majority of my friends and family has been there and NOT one of them think we should stay there. People saying we need to finish so all those soldiers didnt die in vain. Sorry but isnt fighting for oil vain? Iraq is not my country, The threat was not originated from that country. It actually scares me how nieve the majority of you are when it comes to jumping on the "lets be crazy and invade" bandwagon. Al-Qaeda?! Seriously, any terrorist organization is being called that. Who are they exactly. Not anyone in particular anymore.. If your referencing the problem in Iraq to Al-Qaeda then you are wrong. Osama is probably already dead, they know it and its all just a rouse to keep us fighting to benefit all the contractors, mercinarie armies and oil companies. But hey, no one cares right? Everyone is so quick to jump on the "hate"wagon!

I have to say that Mary Jane has very well informed information "grats on the baby btw". I am proud to have americans like her in this country that are voting for what they believe is right. Like I said, everyone has their own opinion and if your going to vote for mccain then do it becuase your well informed and agree with what he is doing.. not because he is white.

[KoRnKiD H2O]

GI Jane PMS is my new hero :)

[Mary Jane PMS]

GI Jane PMS is my new hero :)

Mine too. I second that motion. :mvcelebration:

[Jane PMS]

Mine too. I second that motion. :mvcelebration:

awww... /blush <3

[PMS Solincia]

Yesterday someone I know told me that they are a Democrat because they are black. Her words, not mine. I said you don't have to be a Democrat because you are black.... she said, show me a black Republican.

She represents quite a lot of US Citizens. It's sad. It really is. She cant tell me why she's voting for Obama, other than that factor.

Like many have said in this thread.... please educate yourselves, and not necessarily with the hyped-up media.... research it.

Please vote. One person said they don't vote, but still had opinions. Okay, if you're not 18 or older, I get that, if you are 18 and older, my opinion.... IF YOU DON'T VOTE YOU DON'T HAVE A RIGHT TO ***** ABOUT ANYTHING!!!

You give up that right when you don't take advantage of your right to try to change it.

[KoRnKiD H2O]

True. If you don't vote, you don't have the right to complain.

[Wifey]

Okay... so I saw this thread about a million times, and because I'm Canadian and cannot vote, I didn't want to even start reading it because any countries politics get me riled up. HOWEVER today, after 2 hours of sleep I couldn't resist, so I began to read (from page 1). I ended on page 4. I'll be honest, 95% of what I've read so far is... well... I don't want to offend anyone, so fill in the blank lol

Here are a few of my thoughts...
1. The world has so many negative thoughts about the US right now, that I'm a) Happy to see someone ACTUALLY knows something like tire pressure affecting gas consumption and b) hoping your new president, whomever he be, make the thoughts about your country more positive. Every US citizen I see/hear is very patriotic... but do you even know what you're standing up for anymore?
2. [B]I hate it when US citizens refer to yourselves as AMERICANS. You are the United States OF AMERICA. You are not America. America consists of you, as well as your bordering countries, no matter how much you wish we weren't there. lol That being said, I'm going to sat something that totally contradicts what i just said lol - When you call yourselves Americans, it's kind of right, because whatever your country does, affects the whole world. Honestly, I feel like I should be able to vote in your election because your president affects my life more and more everyday, which, to be honest is so messed up it can only be described in words which would be filtered lol
3. R-E-S-E-A-R-C-H!!!!! All of your lives are affected by this election, research who will be running your lives, your country, and essentially, this world. That mean seem exaggerated, but if the next presidency is anything like the last, he won't just be a Nation's Leader, he'll pretty much be a World Leader. You all, as US citizens owe the world a better choice! Put your own biases aside, stop listening to the super-biased media and ACTUALLY see what the candidates have said. Make your vote dependent upon educated and thorough research as opposed to copying your favorite celebrity, doing what you think is 'in' or listening to what the news says.

Don't hate me ;) I love y'all like you're my actual brothers & sisters.
just couldn't stop my fingers from typing once I saw a particular post lol
I'm sorry if I offeneded anyone... it's okay, you can blame it on my socialist values & morals if it makes you feel better, I promise I won't get mad, Us Canadians are sweet like that lol :P

soooooo what are we supposed to call ourselves? united stateians?!?! lol yea i think American sounds better!!!! even if we are the united states OF AMERICA, when someone says Americans, who do u think of? not canadians, not mexicans, u think of the united states. so i fail to see why it bothers u...it's just a name. it's not like we call ourselves The North Americans...then i could see why that bothered you because you live in north america too. it's not our fault someone named our country something stupid lol

[PMS Pip Sq3ak]

Please vote. One person said they don't vote, but still had opinions. Okay, if you're not 18 or older, I get that, if you are 18 and older, my opinion.... IF YOU DON'T VOTE YOU DON'T HAVE A RIGHT TO ***** ABOUT ANYTHING!!!
You give up that right when you don't take advantage of your right to try to change it.

exactly!!! i think Solincia is my new hero..LOL :D

[H2O Creation]

in your election can you choose not to vote for any of the parties...?

[KoRnKiD H2O]

um.. vote independent if you don't like either party

[H2O Creation]

so you cant vote for "none of the above" no confidence...

[PMS KillrQueen]

I'll try and stay away from reiterating, but just to get this out there i can safely say that just as many white people will vote for mccain because he's not black that black people will vote for obama because he is.
no one race is special and without their own uninformed idiots.

This is just the first statewide voting registration chart i've found via race

http://sos.georgia.gov/elections/charts/pictures/statewide.GIF

clearly if every registered black person voted in this state for obama...he'd probably still lose.

[PHiNiX]

well im all for obama. mccain is wierd

[PMS Solincia]

clearly if every registered black person voted in this state for obama...he'd probably still lose.

That's assuming that the "white folk" aren't voting democrat.

[PMS Solincia]

Just so that you're aware... not that it's anyones business but I'll make it so... I've never voted for a Republican or Democrat for president... ha ha...but this will be the first year that I do.

Green Party FTW!!

[Jane PMS]

Wheres Al Gore?! lol

[H2O Gangsterism]

jeez this thread is awesome
some good reading

[PMS KillrQueen]

That's assuming that the "white folk" aren't voting democrat.

it was under the assumption that if every white person voted for mccain because he's white and every black person voted for obama likewise that mccain will still win, stemming from any comments made that 'black people are saying they'll vote for obama just because he's black'. Even if that ridiculous comment was true....he still wouldn't win so it doesn't matter. Atleast in the state i found the statistics for.

since the population of black voters is about equal to just white women voters he could still get all the black voters and almost 1/2 of the all white women voters(or white male, it doesn't matter) and still just be hitting even in the polls.

lol,sorry, i probably didn't need to explain everything over again.

[H2O Forester]

I love how people say that Palin doesn't have the experience... Obama has less experience i want McCain to win because Obama hates America.


just my opinion don't. start anything.

[KoRnKiD H2O]

Obama has less experience i want McCain to win because Obama hates America.

Dude.. Obama is a United States Senator.. Palin was a mayor of a small town in Alaska..
and It's a pretty bold statement saying Obama hates America.. some facts/information supporting your claim would be great.

[PMS KillrQueen]

I'd like to show everyone this site:
http://factcheck.org/

it is a site that cross references and fact checks all the BS for/from officials.
I've been watching them for a while and they're by far the most non biased accounts I've found with just as much stuff from one candidate than the other, which is eyeopening in itself meaning that one campaign smears just as much as the other.

[PHiNiX]

lol why would someone run for the presidency of a country he hates....EPIC FAIL

Talking about experiance...PAILIN

does anyone know the real definition of maverick......LOST COW

and dont say obama is a domestic terrorist just because he knew bill ayers or affiliated with him.

[PMS Solincia]

Palin is the Govenor of Alaska... how is that not having experiance?

Bush was the Govenor of Texas.

Clinton was the Govenor of Arkansas.

I love how the media and everyone else wants to jump on Palin because she's a Govenor, yet they seem to forget that the last TWO PRESIDENTS jumped directly from that post to President, and she's just running for VICE President.

Foolish Americans....it's okay when MEN do it, but heck no it's not okay for a WOMAN, is that it? They might as well just tell her to go make them a sandwich!

[PMS KillrQueen]

i don't think it really has so much to do with the fact that she's a woman at this point that it is that she's just an opposing candidate. Every candidate is getting anything and everything about them poked and prodded and misjudged about their past and present, she not getting treated any worse or better than any of the others as far as i can see. McCain and Obama get it way worse...do don't see 1/2 the character defamation commercials for the vice presidents.

[Mary Jane PMS]

My personal opinion: RACE and GENDER are not important when choosing the next leaders of our great country. It is so sad to me that people still make it an issue. Aren't we past this?

OBAMA FTW!

[PMS Solincia]

My personal opinion: RACE and GENDER are not important when choosing the next leaders of our great country. It is so sad to me that people still make it an issue. Aren't we past this?

OBAMA FTW!

I couldn't agree more, we may be past this... You, me, and many others, but there are thousands if not more who are not.

[Wifey]

lol why would someone run for the presidency of a country he hates....EPIC FAIL

Talking about experiance...PAILIN

does anyone know the real definition of maverick......LOST COW

and dont say obama is a domestic terrorist just because he knew bill ayers or affiliated with him.

it does mean that but it also means...

One that refuses to abide by the dictates of or resists adherence to a group; a dissenter.
Being independent in thought and action or exhibiting such independence
Example: maverick politicians; a maverick decision.

From: http://www.thefreedictionary.com/maverick

i highly doubt H2O Maverick would make his name just that with the definition being that it was solely a lost baby cow lol

[PHiNiX]

LoL if you are such a smart person, why would you affiliate yourself with a word that has more then one literal meaning. LOST COW

1. An unbranded range animal, especially a calf that has become separated from its mother, traditionally considered the property of the first person who brands it.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/maverick

[H2O Forester]

Dude.. Obama is a United States Senator.. Palin was a mayor of a small town in Alaska..
and It's a pretty bold statement saying Obama hates America.. some facts/information supporting your claim would be great.



dude here you go his wife hates america http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xMlOKvTZcqM sry for not getting a direct look but ya.

by the way palin was a governor.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wWRs6avkm4s he hates white people.


why do you want someone who's mentor is racist and hates america

and palin has been in government longer than obama.

and i have way more facts just look it up online.

[H2O Forester]

Dude peoples need to stop listening to fox news.....it is the biggest piece of trash in the history of television....remember, they wanted bush in office and bashed all the people running against him...and look what happend

unless your net worth is 5 million dollars. do not vote for mccain

mccain=rich white man who would love to see his family make more money....sounds familier

obama=rich black man who would love to see equality and a better financial state of are great nation


and to all the people who say obama hates america............STOP LISTENING/WATCHING FOX NEWS....learn to get information on your own, don't let things be spoon feed to you.



to all the people who think obama is un patriotic give me a reason and I will dispprove you with real facts

so you dont like people that try to become someone or own a business that offer people jobs?

[PHiNiX]

what the hell are you talking about

forester dont makes comments if you dont know what are talking about

that video is dumb that you posted about his wife...lol for the first time im proud of my country to


im proud of the fact that they can look past the color of someones skin and look at what they really are

thats what she was talking about by the way....

i think you need to do some fact checking

[KoRnKiD H2O]

dude here you go his wife hates america http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xMlOKvTZcqM sry for not getting a direct look but ya.

by the way palin was a governor.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wWRs6avkm4s he hates white people.

The first video was absolute garbage.. "for the first time in my adult lifetime, I'm really proud of my country" where does it say she hates America. You logic is insisting that if one isn't "really proud" of something.. they hate it? lolololol.

As for the second video.. maybe you should watch it again. It's talking about the Reverend.. and it seems to me that the man doesn't hate Whites.. he hates his Government and all of it's corruption.

[H2O Forester]

i don't wanna waste my time phinix.

[Sapphire]

this thread is hot.

[PHiNiX]

please dont forester, i wouldnt want you to waste your time

[Mightybigone]

Can't we all just hug and sing songs around the camp fire?

[PMS Solincia]

Can't we all just hug and sing songs around the camp fire?

I'm gonna lay down my sword and shield... down by the riverside, down by the riverside, down by the riverside, I'm gonna lay done my sword and shield... down by the riverside. Ain't gonna study that WAR NO MORE!!!!

I ain't gonna study war no more I ain't gonna study war no more, I ain't gonna study that war no mo-or-ore....

Oh to once again be the young idealist I was in college carrying signs and marching through the streets singing and chanting as if anyone really cared. How I miss the days of standing tall and firm against the police as they threaten to arrest me if I don't remove myself from that "private" property that my tax dollars pay for, with their handcuffs that my tax dollars pay for. As I yelled and shouted "get your hands off me, I pay for your paycheck.".... Oh... to be young again with such passion...

Close the windows... batten down the hatches... turn on the boob tube and desensitize my soul. Hello America, the world is falling apart around me, children are going hungry and the govenment wants more of my money... do we realize it? No, I still have money for that large flatscreen and xboxlive, I'm good.

[Mary Jane PMS]

dude here you go his wife hates america http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xMlOKvTZcqM sry for not getting a direct look but ya.

by the way palin was a governor.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wWRs6avkm4s he hates white people.


why do you want someone who's mentor is racist and hates america

and palin has been in government longer than obama.

and i have way more facts just look it up online.


WOW! Just WOW! Those videos are so stupid, and the first one is wayyyyy off. Geez. It makes me sad that that is what people think, and to post it here!... What happened to facts?

If only people actually looked for facts instead of using hate speech and fear to make their point. This is just my personal opinion, but really. "Is SHE ready to defend the country from terrorism?" Do you think that McCain's wife better? And since when is it the First Lady's job to defend our country? McCain's wife is like a blow up barbie doll. Sorry McCain supporters, but I cannot even imagine her as our first lady.

And as for his church... he is not the preacher... Obama NEVER said anything hateful towards America. Why would you devote your life to helping people, helping this country, helping the world, if you hated it? C'mon, really. If you are who you associate with then Palin is anti-American because she associated with a group that wants to make Alaska withdraw from the union. Or her church which thinks that being gay is a choice. And through prayer they will become straight. Excuse me, but all my friends who are gay KNOW it is not just a choice, it is how they FEEL. Not something you can just change.

Obama is as American as they come. And he is going to be the next President. I am moving to Canada if McCain is elected. And taking to the streets in protest. *sigh* All we need is more of the same. And that is what McCain is... the same. Maybe not Bush in body, but Bush in mind. He voted along side him 90% if the time. And he says he is bipartisan. HA! :mvangry:

[Mary Jane PMS]

I'm gonna lay down my sword and shield... down by the riverside, down by the riverside, down by the riverside, I'm gonna lay done my sword and shield... down by the riverside. Ain't gonna study that WAR NO MORE!!!!

I ain't gonna study war no more I ain't gonna study war no more, I ain't gonna study that war no mo-or-ore....

Oh to once again be the young idealist I was in college carrying signs and marching through the streets singing and chanting as if anyone really cared. How I miss the days of standing tall and firm against the police as they threaten to arrest me if I don't remove myself from that "private" property that my tax dollars pay for, with their handcuffs that my tax dollars pay for. As I yelled and shouted "get your hands off me, I pay for your paycheck.".... Oh... to be young again with such passion...

Close the windows... batten down the hatches... turn on the boob tube and desensitize my soul. Hello America, the world is falling apart around me, children are going hungry and the govenment wants more of my money... do we realize it? No, I still have money for that large flatscreen and xboxlive, I'm good.


That was so poetic. I love you! Green Party FTW for sure! But that just can't happen until the country gets on the right track. I'm lucky tho, here in Colorado we have some great candidates from the Green Party.

[H2O Forester]

lol it was a joke response i was just getting some stupid videos

[mariomario81]

time to ruin the flow
i dont like obama
=P

[CrazyLSU]

time to ruin the flow
i dont like obama
=P

I dont like him either but i think he may be the best thing for the country as a whole. he may not be the best thing for me personally but if we can get the economy back running smoothly then whatever i lose in more taxes i can make up in stock profits. The only thing i am really worried about him with is the national security.

[PhX Sailin]

I say either way were screwed. but if i was forced to vote (and if i could) i would vote for obama.... i dont agree with all of what he stands for, and same applys for mccain. So what if we have to pay more taxes. (last time i check if it was you pay more if you made over 250,000$) but either way it will help our country more....

[CrazyLSU]

I say either way were screwed. but if i was forced to vote (and if i could) i would vote for obama.... i dont agree with all of what he stands for, and same applys for mccain. So what if we have to pay more taxes. (last time i check if it was you pay more if you made over 250,000$) but either way it will help our country more....

its down to 150,000$. :( if you make more then a quarter million you are already paying out the ass anyway. Whats a couple more percent :p

[PHiNiX]

unless you are rich i would vote obama

[CrazyLSU]

what do you define as rich though. thats the big question right now.

[PHiNiX]

well having a high income. is what i would account as rich mid-high income

250,000 is when the tax cuts even out for both candidates..but higher then that obama would give a lower cut to the richer person and mccain would give a higher cut

[Mightybigone]

Let's not forget $250,000 in some cities isn't really considered "rich" with cost of living in those areas so high. Joe Biden is out there saying it's gonna be $150,000 now.


After Bush's tax cuts expire, all of our taxes go up. Anyone know if Obama's little calculator takes that into account?

[Sapphire]

WOW! Just WOW! Those videos are so stupid, and the first one is wayyyyy off. Geez. It makes me sad that that is what people think, and to post it here!... What happened to facts?

If only people actually looked for facts instead of using hate speech and fear to make their point. This is just my personal opinion, but really. "Is SHE ready to defend the country from terrorism?" Do you think that McCain's wife better? And since when is it the First Lady's job to defend our country? McCain's wife is like a blow up barbie doll. Sorry McCain supporters, but I cannot even imagine her as our first lady.

And as for his church... he is not the preacher... Obama NEVER said anything hateful towards America. Why would you devote your life to helping people, helping this country, helping the world, if you hated it? C'mon, really. If you are who you associate with then Palin is anti-American because she associated with a group that wants to make Alaska withdraw from the union. Or her church which thinks that being gay is a choice. And through prayer they will become straight. Excuse me, but all my friends who are gay KNOW it is not just a choice, it is how they FEEL. Not something you can just change.

Obama is as American as they come. And he is going to be the next President. I am moving to Canada if McCain is elected. And taking to the streets in protest. *sigh* All we need is more of the same. And that is what McCain is... the same. Maybe not Bush in body, but Bush in mind. He voted along side him 90% if the time. And he says he is bipartisan. HA! :mvangry:

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Mary knows her stuff. So far she's the only one i've seen who stands her ground and doesn't go based of gossip and rumors and no im not saying that just b/c i support Obama.

All i have left to say is.

5 DAYS!

[PHiNiX]

mighty. they dont care what your cost of living is all they care is how much money you make.

[naturaL)]

democrat 08'

[PHiNiX]

Hell yeah

[Melly]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_TGf2o4qeBo
haha ^^

[PHiNiX]

thank god i allready voted

[IxI tC IxI]

Mccccccccain :-)
AND
PALIN .. YAYY HOPE THEY WIN.. HURRY UP TUESDAY

[PHiNiX]

lol i hope mccain dosnt win, he annoys me

[AFF IRONMAN]

same here

[PHiNiX]

have you ever noticed that when he makes a speach, he blinks to much

and i was reading that people who blink to much are hiding somthing that they dont want revealed,

[Mary Jane PMS]

have you ever noticed that when he makes a speach, he blinks to much

and i was reading that people who blink to much are hiding somthing that they dont want revealed,

LMAO.. awesome. Just what we need.

Obama FTW! :D I want it to be Tuesday soooo bad! I took the day off. I think I may try to help get people to the polls... too bad my car is a POS. My Grandmother is 98 and voted Obama. Smart lady!!!

[PHiNiX]

your grandma is smart....OBAMA

[PMS Missy]

GOBAMA! yeah!

[Equinox Jr H2O]

Obamaobamaobamaobamaobamaobamaobamaobamaobamaobama obamaobamaobamaobama
obamaobama obama!

[H2O Gangsterism]

have you ever noticed that when he makes a speach, he blinks to much

and i was reading that people who blink to much are hiding somthing that they dont want revealed,

hes like 70... i think ud blink alot 2